After speaking to Republican senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham, who attended the briefing with Mr Obama, Gen. Keane [a former vice chief of staff of the US Army] said: "What [Obama] won't do is topple the regime. There's a distinction here. What he has told the two senators is that he also intends to assist the opposition forces, so he is going to degrade Assad's military capacity and he is going to assist and upgrade the opposition forces with training assistance." [my bolding]
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
On the car radio this morning there was this scholar guy talking about how the current situation in Syria was predicted by the bible and how there's a biblical solution to it all.
The takeaway was the guy sounded learned and not at all like he was absolutely barking mad.
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
It doesn't matter what the goal is.
The goal could be to have Obama do some commanding and chiefing... to have Obama administering justice to the Syrian seamstresses, and steelworkers, and students, and teachers, maids and pullman porters, that shared simple meals and bunked together on floors.
A goal, if a goal is needed, could be culled from Obama's speeches.
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
The amazing thing is that these feckless evil assholes don't think anyone else can figure out their brilliant subterfuges, deborah. Yeah, he's not my President.
The takeaway was the guy sounded learned and not at all like he was absolutely barking mad.
An impressive achievement, I thought at the time.
I bet Gen. Keane sounded learned and not absolutely barking mad, either. Some people claim the President sounds learned, as well. I just don't think those folks know what "learned" means, myself.
There's a line in the song "Mr. Jones" by Counting Crows. Something about a girl who begins dancing Flamenco and is "suddenly beautiful."
I know what they're talking about because I saw a Flamenco show in Spain and experienced that strange phenomenon for myself. "Suddenly beautiful" is exactly accurate.
I had a hard time telling what was going on, frankly, but at one point, later on in the show, I sort of intuited that the man and the woman were mourning their dead baby and I started crying.
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
....to fully support the Muslim Brotherhood or al-Qaeda throughout the Middle-East. Hello? Look at his actions and policies. By attacking Assad's forces, Obama will be supporting the organization that brought down the World Trade Center.
Suppose that Congress debates intervention in Syria and votes 'No'.
If Congress votes 'No' and Obama nevertheless decides to proceed with attacks against Syria he places flag-level officers (generals and admirals) in terrible position. Obama will in essence be forcing them to choose: are you loyal to *me* or to the Constitution?
The showing the sole of one's shoe is an insult in the Muslim culture. Stepping on your enemy's picture or flag is to insult your enemy or his flag.
Remember that photo of Obama in the Oval Office a few days ago? He was standing with the sole of his shoe on the desk of the President of the United States. And his right hand was pointing to it just so the message would be seen by those for whom it was intended.
But that was near the end of the Flamenco show. Earlier on it was more like an ass-kicking rock concert, but much more authentic.
I got all excited by it all and would just sort of yell out loud every now and then for no reason I understood except I couldn't help myself.
At one point, they stopped the show. Just stopped it. Full stop.
One of the dancers, a woman older than the rest came right to the edge of the stage, right in the middle and started scolding the audience in English.
I almost died of embarrassment, sitting there in my seat. I thought to myself, "Oh dear fucking Lord! She's pissed off about my yelling, disrespecting their native art form, and I'm going to be asked to leave right here in front of everybody!"
Nope. She scolded ALL of us. We weren't yelling ENOUGH And, she said, if we're going to yell, do it right. It's not "hey" or "ay", it's "Olé!"
You see, I was yelling "hey" and "ay" because I thought that yelling "Olé" would make me sound like a disrespectful tourist poseur.
Sometimes it's kind of weird, the way things turn out.
ed, when doesn't President Peace Prize move the goalposts? The amazing thing is that they don't seem to think anyone will notice. Admittedly, they spend a lot of time around people like Biden and McCain, but still....
Great story, Mitchell. Yes, sometimes it's kind of weird the way things turn out.
Haz, I think you go too far with Obama being simpatico with al Qaeda/MB.
If he seriously hurts Assad and trains rebels, it is about a proxy war with Putin. Russia and Iran both have big political problems with neighboring Sunni populations. As does China.
Personally, I think Obama should align with Iran and Russia. What are the reasons he does not?
Don't you wonder what would happen if we just armed every citizen in Syria. Just air dropped a few million sets of guns and ammo all over the place. The bad guys already have their hands full with their own weapons, so they won't get any advantage, but the innocent unarmed masses could defend themselves and pick a side, make a new one, or maybe even carve out their own area of security.
Here in the U.S., we have a tremendous protection from foreign forces or government military action thanks to our Second Amendment and a sufficiently common American philosophy of self defense. What is happening there could never happen here. We only vote ourselves into submission.
I would support arming the populace in great numbers, and just letting it work it itself out. My sympathy and neocon tendency is with those who are unarmed and who only want to be free and left alone. My belief is that these are the only people we should be helping, and what they need is guns in their hands so that when a force of Assad's or Al Qaeda comes to town, they meet a hail of bullets from every window.
We could send a bunch of red paint too, and I'm serious.
deborah, I think you and Haz are both over-thinking it. What evidence is there that Obama is some great strategic thinker of any variety, as opposed to o an inept bungler who lacks ANY kind of vision?
Great story, Mitchell. Yes, sometimes it's kind of weird the way things turn out.
Haz, I think you go too far with Obama being simpatico with al Qaeda/MB.
If he seriously hurts Assad and trains rebels, it is about a proxy war with Putin. Russia and Iran both have big political problems with neighboring Sunni populations. As does China.
Doubtless, he wants to put Vlad in his place.
He forgets Chicago Rules don't apply here.
Much as LBJ forgot.
Icepick said...
deborah, I think you and Haz are both over-thinking it. What evidence is there that Obama is some great strategic thinker of any variety, as opposed to o an inept bungler who lacks ANY kind of vision?
You got it.
And, as far as goalposts, I was just wondering if this was part of that spur-of-the-moment decision to consult congress.
Icepick, don't be daft (wink), I'm talking about the people pulling Obama's strings.
What makes you think they're any more talented than he is? Or that he follows direction well?
All evidence suggests that Obama is a lazy narcissist with a highly inflated opinion of his own intellect and abilities. People who would choose THIS as their instrument must not be all that capable either, and I expect that on foreign policy Obama is frequently off the leash.
On domestic policy the main thing is to make certain money keeps flowing to government union types and the financiers. Mission accomplished there. The foreign policy pour masters care about is letting in as many foreign peasants as possible to further depress employment, wages and votes.
The story about the CIA trained rebels really has me wondering: Exactly how is it that we are NOT at war with Syria?
Quote from the Telegraph:
During a meeting at the White House, the president assured Senator John McCain that after months of delay the US was meeting its commitment to back moderate elements of the opposition.
Mr Obama said that a 50-man cell, believed to have been trained by US special forces in Jordan, was making its way across the border into Syria, according to the New York Times.
So we're sending in armed troops to kill Assad and his supporters and overthrow his government. Again, how are we not at war with Assad?
I withdraw my objections to the bombing campaign. Let's bomb the fuck out of Syria, because why not? We're at war with them, and have been at war with them, and will continue to be at war with them until Assad's 11 year-old son gets blasted by a fuel bomb.
But can someone please show me the document in which Congress authorized this war?
Bari is a port town on the Adriatic in Italy. In 1943 or so it was an important port for the Allies as they moved up the boot of Italy.
One night the Germans sent in a bunch of bombers on a surprise mission. They bombed a bunch of ships and the port. Among the US ships they hit was one containing poison gas, mustard IIRC. There was a giant leak of the stuff and many were injured and killed by the gas. The problems were compounded b the fact that the doctors in the area didn't know what they were treating.
The US, you see, had been shipping in poison gas to Europe 'just in case'. The Germans didn't know this, of course, and couldn't have known. The US didn't actually acknowledge the incident until 1956 or 1957, as it was a PR nightmare. It's doubtful the Nazis ever had any idea what had actually happened.
There's an interesting medical side bit to the story, but I'll let anyone interested find that on their own.
But the lesson for the current situation is this: Bombing chemical weapons can have the same effect as USING chemical weapons.
Here's the whole bit:I'll tell you this story and then I really do have to go. My five-year-old grandson, as I was leaving San Francisco yesterday, he said to me, Mimi, my name, Mimi, war with Syria, are you yes war with Syria, no, war with Syria. And he's five years old. We're not talking about war; we're talking about action. Yes war with Syria, no with war in Syria. I said, 'Well, what do you think?' He said, 'I think no war.' I said, 'Well, I generally agree with that but you know, they have killed hundreds of children, they've killed hundreds of children there. ' And he said, five years old, 'Were these children in the United States?' And I said, 'No, but they're children wherever they are.'
So I don't know what news he's listening to or -- but even a five year old child has to -- you know, with the wisdom of our interest has affected our interests or it affects our interests because, again, it was outside of the circle of civilized behavior. It was humanity drew a line decades ago that i think if we ignore, we do so to the peril of many other people who can suffer.
So, killing children is bad. Except, I guess, when Obama does it with drones. Or cruise missiles. Or whatever. Then killing children is worthy of giving someone a peace prize.
Pelosi want to keep Syrian kids form being killed, but believes that abortion is a sacrament (her word) here in America. Raging hypocrisy being used to justify war. A war she'd threaten to impeach any Republican president for initiating.
This is why I'm not bothering to vote next year. I'm not voting for some generic Republican Congressman or Senator: I'm voting for John Boehner and Mitch McConnell. What's the fucking point?
Wait a minute. Our CIA has trained a bunch of rebels to make war in Syria? And we wonder why Assad is on a killing streak?
We have no business training their rebels. No wonder there has been 100,000 fatalities so far. How many of those fatalities have been killed by our guys?
ed, has Cantor ever NOT supported military action? Unfortunately the Republican party has confused belligerence with being tough. Not everything should be about dropping bombs just to make a point.
Also, my vote hasn't mattered in years. I've voted for two winners out of all votes cast in the last several election cycles, and neither of them has done any good.
About Pelosi believing that abortion is a sacrament: She may be an idiot and inconsistent with regard to her Catholic beliefs and her actual practice of the faith, but I don't believe she ever said abortion is a sacrament.
I think that characterization came about because of her use of the term "sacred ground" during a press conference. You can watch the pertinent part here. The context of her use of that term was when she was refusing to answer a question about how she could make a distinction between Gosnell-type murder and late-term abortions. She said she didn't want to go there because the whole subject of abortions and life, as a mother and a Catholic, was in the realm of the sacred for her.
Dishonest and inarticulate avoidance of the issue, sure, but I don't think it can be interpreted as saying abortion itself is sacred or a sacrament.
Never the less, she is committed to the murder of unborn babies in America, while wanting to defend Syrian children. I believe that is hypocritical. You may believe it isn't.
Michael, I completely agree that her support is not only hypocritical but abhorrent. But I do think it's important that we not misrepresent what she says, and I think that piece you linked to does to a certain extent also misrepresent the context in which she made that remark. That video link I provided is quite short, only about 2 mins.; I think you'll see that she really isn't using "sacred" in regard to abortion but rather to an area of belief about life, etc., that she doesn't want to go into. Very muddled, of course, but, hey, it's Pelosi.
Don't stay home, vote. I usually vote Libertarian, not because I think they will win, but because I want their ideas to be taken seriously. Support someone you agree with, no matter what their chances.
55 comments:
I'm wondering if the Choom Gang thinks restarting the Cold War will get people back on their side.
Acouple of things about the Choom-Vlad feud to consider:
Both Russia and Red China's are digging in their heels to frustrate him, particularly after his ouster of Khadaffy.
And now there's talk, if the op comes off, it will be more substantial than Choom originally said.
Looks like he's going to throw a tantrum.
More from Ed's second link:
After speaking to Republican senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham, who attended the briefing with Mr Obama, Gen. Keane [a former vice chief of staff of the US Army] said: "What [Obama] won't do is topple the regime. There's a distinction here. What he has told the two senators is that he also intends to assist the opposition forces, so he is going to degrade Assad's military capacity and he is going to assist and upgrade the opposition forces with training assistance." [my bolding]
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
On the car radio this morning there was this scholar guy talking about how the current situation in Syria was predicted by the bible and how there's a biblical solution to it all.
The takeaway was the guy sounded learned and not at all like he was absolutely barking mad.
An impressive achievement, I thought at the time.
... beats me.
I heard John McCain on the radio this morning, as well. He was talking about Syria, spouting conclusory boilerplate.
You could easily program a computer to do the same thing, mouth the same platitudes, was my impression.
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
It doesn't matter what the goal is.
The goal could be to have Obama do some commanding and chiefing... to have Obama administering justice to the Syrian seamstresses, and steelworkers, and students, and teachers, maids and pullman porters, that shared simple meals and bunked together on floors.
A goal, if a goal is needed, could be culled from Obama's speeches.
Gee, ed, you really think Obama will tell us one thing and then do something else? I'm shocked you could think such a thing!
/ faux sincerity
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
The amazing thing is that these feckless evil assholes don't think anyone else can figure out their brilliant subterfuges, deborah. Yeah, he's not my President.
I got annoyed, listening to politics on the car radio, so I switched to some Flamenco music that I have on compact disc.
I enjoyed listening to it.
It's a pleasurable challenge, imagining the dancers on stage.
The takeaway was the guy sounded learned and not at all like he was absolutely barking mad.
An impressive achievement, I thought at the time.
I bet Gen. Keane sounded learned and not absolutely barking mad, either. Some people claim the President sounds learned, as well. I just don't think those folks know what "learned" means, myself.
You could easily program a computer to do the same thing, mouth the same platitudes, was my impression.
Most of 'our' politicians couldn't pass a Turing Test.
There's a line in the song "Mr. Jones" by Counting Crows. Something about a girl who begins dancing Flamenco and is "suddenly beautiful."
I know what they're talking about because I saw a Flamenco show in Spain and experienced that strange phenomenon for myself. "Suddenly beautiful" is exactly accurate.
I had a hard time telling what was going on, frankly, but at one point, later on in the show, I sort of intuited that the man and the woman were mourning their dead baby and I started crying.
lol Allen.
commanding and chiefing...lol again.
I was going more toward keeping this civil war going, with the general 'benefits' of
-jump-starting a Cold War vibe (which Putin would get off on, also)
-giving Israel an opportunity to grab the Golan
-allow Qatar and SA to build their pipeline through Syria
-further degrading Sunni-Shia relations
-ruin any chance at detente with Iran
Week-end With McCain
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
....to fully support the Muslim Brotherhood or al-Qaeda throughout the Middle-East. Hello? Look at his actions and policies. By attacking Assad's forces, Obama will be supporting the organization that brought down the World Trade Center.
Suppose that Congress debates intervention in Syria and votes 'No'.
If Congress votes 'No' and Obama nevertheless decides to proceed with attacks against Syria he places flag-level officers (generals and admirals) in terrible position. Obama will in essence be forcing them to choose: are you loyal to *me* or to the Constitution?
The showing the sole of one's shoe is an insult in the Muslim culture. Stepping on your enemy's picture or flag is to insult your enemy or his flag.
Remember that photo of Obama in the Oval Office a few days ago? He was standing with the sole of his shoe on the desk of the President of the United States. And his right hand was pointing to it just so the message would be seen by those for whom it was intended.
But that was near the end of the Flamenco show. Earlier on it was more like an ass-kicking rock concert, but much more authentic.
I got all excited by it all and would just sort of yell out loud every now and then for no reason I understood except I couldn't help myself.
At one point, they stopped the show. Just stopped it. Full stop.
One of the dancers, a woman older than the rest came right to the edge of the stage, right in the middle and started scolding the audience in English.
I almost died of embarrassment, sitting there in my seat. I thought to myself, "Oh dear fucking Lord! She's pissed off about my yelling, disrespecting their native art form, and I'm going to be asked to leave right here in front of everybody!"
Nope. She scolded ALL of us. We weren't yelling ENOUGH And, she said, if we're going to yell, do it right. It's not "hey" or "ay", it's "Olé!"
You see, I was yelling "hey" and "ay" because I thought that yelling "Olé" would make me sound like a disrespectful tourist poseur.
Sometimes it's kind of weird, the way things turn out.
deborah said...
If what this general says is true, Obama's actual goal is...
Not what's going to end up happening.
Sounds like what LBJ was thinking in '65.
Icepick said...
Gee, ed, you really think Obama will tell us one thing and then do something else? I'm shocked you could think such a thing!
/ faux sincerity
I just point out the article as a sign Choom's moved the goalposts.
ed, when doesn't President Peace Prize move the goalposts? The amazing thing is that they don't seem to think anyone will notice. Admittedly, they spend a lot of time around people like Biden and McCain, but still....
Mitchell, please keep posting about the Flamenco dancers. It is pleasant contrast.
Great story, Mitchell. Yes, sometimes it's kind of weird the way things turn out.
Haz, I think you go too far with Obama being simpatico with al Qaeda/MB.
If he seriously hurts Assad and trains rebels, it is about a proxy war with Putin. Russia and Iran both have big political problems with neighboring Sunni populations. As does China.
Personally, I think Obama should align with Iran and Russia. What are the reasons he does not?
Don't you wonder what would happen if we just armed every citizen in Syria. Just air dropped a few million sets of guns and ammo all over the place. The bad guys already have their hands full with their own weapons, so they won't get any advantage, but the innocent unarmed masses could defend themselves and pick a side, make a new one, or maybe even carve out their own area of security.
Here in the U.S., we have a tremendous protection from foreign forces or government military action thanks to our Second Amendment and a sufficiently common American philosophy of self defense. What is happening there could never happen here. We only vote ourselves into submission.
I would support arming the populace in great numbers, and just letting it work it itself out. My sympathy and neocon tendency is with those who are unarmed and who only want to be free and left alone. My belief is that these are the only people we should be helping, and what they need is guns in their hands so that when a force of Assad's or Al Qaeda comes to town, they meet a hail of bullets from every window.
We could send a bunch of red paint too, and I'm serious.
deborah, I think you and Haz are both over-thinking it. What evidence is there that Obama is some great strategic thinker of any variety, as opposed to o an inept bungler who lacks ANY kind of vision?
deborah said...
Great story, Mitchell. Yes, sometimes it's kind of weird the way things turn out.
Haz, I think you go too far with Obama being simpatico with al Qaeda/MB.
If he seriously hurts Assad and trains rebels, it is about a proxy war with Putin. Russia and Iran both have big political problems with neighboring Sunni populations. As does China.
Doubtless, he wants to put Vlad in his place.
He forgets Chicago Rules don't apply here.
Much as LBJ forgot.
Icepick said...
deborah, I think you and Haz are both over-thinking it. What evidence is there that Obama is some great strategic thinker of any variety, as opposed to o an inept bungler who lacks ANY kind of vision?
You got it.
And, as far as goalposts, I was just wondering if this was part of that spur-of-the-moment decision to consult congress.
bags, make it so, Number One.
Icepick, don't be daft (wink), I'm talking about the people pulling Obama's strings.
Icepick, don't be daft (wink), I'm talking about the people pulling Obama's strings.
What makes you think they're any more talented than he is? Or that he follows direction well?
All evidence suggests that Obama is a lazy narcissist with a highly inflated opinion of his own intellect and abilities. People who would choose THIS as their instrument must not be all that capable either, and I expect that on foreign policy Obama is frequently off the leash.
On domestic policy the main thing is to make certain money keeps flowing to government union types and the financiers. Mission accomplished there. The foreign policy pour masters care about is letting in as many foreign peasants as possible to further depress employment, wages and votes.
A new pair of headlines at the top of Drudge:
Boehner will support Obama call for military action in Syria...
First 'rebels' armed and trained by CIA 'on way to battlefield'...
Good times are ahead, no doubt.
The story about the CIA trained rebels really has me wondering: Exactly how is it that we are NOT at war with Syria?
Quote from the Telegraph:
During a meeting at the White House, the president assured Senator John McCain that after months of delay the US was meeting its commitment to back moderate elements of the opposition.
Mr Obama said that a 50-man cell, believed to have been trained by US special forces in Jordan, was making its way across the border into Syria, according to the New York Times.
So we're sending in armed troops to kill Assad and his supporters and overthrow his government. Again, how are we not at war with Assad?
I withdraw my objections to the bombing campaign. Let's bomb the fuck out of Syria, because why not? We're at war with them, and have been at war with them, and will continue to be at war with them until Assad's 11 year-old son gets blasted by a fuel bomb.
But can someone please show me the document in which Congress authorized this war?
It will be interesting to see, though, if we end up with another Bari Incident on out hands.
"What makes you think they're any more talented than he is? Or that he follows direction well?"
I'm not saying anything new. This is about greed and/or true believers.
Hey! Good stuff about Boehner LOL stock up on the popcorn. The gross microwave kind brought to you by farm subsidies and chemical plants.
Mitchell, please keep posting about the Flamenco dancers. It is pleasant contrast.
I would, if I could, but I can't.
That's the end of the story, except that they all lived happily ever after.
What's a Bari incident?
Mitchell, just keep making stuff up, I won't know the difference!
Bari is a port town on the Adriatic in Italy. In 1943 or so it was an important port for the Allies as they moved up the boot of Italy.
One night the Germans sent in a bunch of bombers on a surprise mission. They bombed a bunch of ships and the port. Among the US ships they hit was one containing poison gas, mustard IIRC. There was a giant leak of the stuff and many were injured and killed by the gas. The problems were compounded b the fact that the doctors in the area didn't know what they were treating.
The US, you see, had been shipping in poison gas to Europe 'just in case'. The Germans didn't know this, of course, and couldn't have known. The US didn't actually acknowledge the incident until 1956 or 1957, as it was a PR nightmare. It's doubtful the Nazis ever had any idea what had actually happened.
There's an interesting medical side bit to the story, but I'll let anyone interested find that on their own.
But the lesson for the current situation is this: Bombing chemical weapons can have the same effect as USING chemical weapons.
Pelosi uses the wisdom of a five year-old to push for more war. Of course, that's a step up from current leadership, but still.
Here's the whole bit:I'll tell you this story and then I really do have to go. My five-year-old grandson, as I was leaving San Francisco yesterday, he said to me, Mimi, my name, Mimi, war with Syria, are you yes war with Syria, no, war with Syria. And he's five years old. We're not talking about war; we're talking about action. Yes war with Syria, no with war in Syria. I said, 'Well, what do you think?' He said, 'I think no war.' I said, 'Well, I generally agree with that but you know, they have killed hundreds of children, they've killed hundreds of children there. ' And he said, five years old, 'Were these children in the United States?' And I said, 'No, but they're children wherever they are.'
So I don't know what news he's listening to or -- but even a five year old child has to -- you know, with the wisdom of our interest has affected our interests or it affects our interests because, again, it was outside of the circle of civilized behavior. It was humanity drew a line decades ago that i think if we ignore, we do so to the peril of many other people who can suffer.
So, killing children is bad. Except, I guess, when Obama does it with drones. Or cruise missiles. Or whatever. Then killing children is worthy of giving someone a peace prize.
Thanks, I.
And now Cantor is on board with military action against Syria.
Boehner is dead to me.
Pelosi want to keep Syrian kids form being killed, but believes that abortion is a sacrament (her word) here in America. Raging hypocrisy being used to justify war. A war she'd threaten to impeach any Republican president for initiating.
Boehner is dead to me.
This is why I'm not bothering to vote next year. I'm not voting for some generic Republican Congressman or Senator: I'm voting for John Boehner and Mitch McConnell. What's the fucking point?
And how embarrassing is it that Dennis Rodman looks like the most competent foreign policy professional we've got at the moment?
I guess it's better to kill Syrian kids now before they grow up an know how to make bombs and use guns.
Rodman is the best spy.
I mean, could you take that guy seriously as a spy? No. That's why the ruse works so well!
Wait a minute. Our CIA has trained a bunch of rebels to make war in Syria? And we wonder why Assad is on a killing streak?
We have no business training their rebels. No wonder there has been 100,000 fatalities so far. How many of those fatalities have been killed by our guys?
No wonder there has been 100,000 fatalities so far. How many of those fatalities have been killed by our guys?
Not nearly enough, according to Obama & Co. You know that President Peace Prize demands a high body count so he can look butch.
Icepick said...
And now Cantor is on board with military action against Syria.
Whig or blackmail.
I'm thinking blackmail.
PS If you stay home, you really give the Choom Gang absolute power.
Boots on the ground?
Boots?
We already got boots on the ground!
We don't need no more stinking boots on the ground!
ed, has Cantor ever NOT supported military action? Unfortunately the Republican party has confused belligerence with being tough. Not everything should be about dropping bombs just to make a point.
Also, my vote hasn't mattered in years. I've voted for two winners out of all votes cast in the last several election cycles, and neither of them has done any good.
Michael Haz,
About Pelosi believing that abortion is a sacrament: She may be an idiot and inconsistent with regard to her Catholic beliefs and her actual practice of the faith, but I don't believe she ever said abortion is a sacrament.
I think that characterization came about because of her use of the term "sacred ground" during a press conference. You can watch the pertinent part here. The context of her use of that term was when she was refusing to answer a question about how she could make a distinction between Gosnell-type murder and late-term abortions. She said she didn't want to go there because the whole subject of abortions and life, as a mother and a Catholic, was in the realm of the sacred for her.
Dishonest and inarticulate avoidance of the issue, sure, but I don't think it can be interpreted as saying abortion itself is sacred or a sacrament.
Lydia, I mistakenly said sacrament when I meant sacred. For that I apologize.
Here is what Pelosi said.
Never the less, she is committed to the murder of unborn babies in America, while wanting to defend Syrian children. I believe that is hypocritical. You may believe it isn't.
Michael, I completely agree that her support is not only hypocritical but abhorrent. But I do think it's important that we not misrepresent what she says, and I think that piece you linked to does to a certain extent also misrepresent the context in which she made that remark. That video link I provided is quite short, only about 2 mins.; I think you'll see that she really isn't using "sacred" in regard to abortion but rather to an area of belief about life, etc., that she doesn't want to go into. Very muddled, of course, but, hey, it's Pelosi.
Don't stay home, vote. I usually vote Libertarian, not because I think they will win, but because I want their ideas to be taken seriously. Support someone you agree with, no matter what their chances.
Post a Comment