Tuesday, April 22, 2014

Andrew Sullivan: The “Quality Of Life” In New Jersey

"What you have here is not an argument, but a prejudice. Why is a head-shop somehow bad for a neighborhood? Why is tourism for casinos fine but for smoking a joint such a terrible thing? Why is legal pot worse for New Jersey’s reputation than the popularity of Jersey Shore and The Real Housewives of New Jersey?
And why, pray, is it a better quality of life to have less personal freedom rather than more?"

Chris Christie explains:
For the people who are enamored with the idea with the income, the tax revenue from [legalized marijuana], go to Colorado and see if you want to live there. See if you want to live in a major city in Colorado where there’s head shops popping up on every corner and people flying into your airport just to come and get high. To me, it’s just not the quality of life we want to have here in the state of New Jersey and there’s no tax revenue that’s worth that.
Who do side with, Andrew Sullivan or Chris Christie?

105 comments:

edutcher said...

Interesting Andy puts it that way, especially since he's all for gay-everything.

PS While the next decade or so will tell the tale, it can't help that even casual use of mary jane has been connected to brain abnormalities.

bagoh20 said...

Oh yea, nobody would ever prefer Colorado to New Jersey. Is he insane? Does he not realize that the term "New Jersey" is the only state name that qualifies as a joke all by itself?
Seriously, just say "New Jersety out loud and people laugh. You can just add it to an unfinished joke and make it work.

A car theif, mobster and a junk man go into a strip bar and a stripper comes over and says: "New Jersey?"

See?

Say "Colorado" and most people will think "yea, I wanna go."

Lem said...

Jersey Shore is/was a cable TV show.

A far cry from real pot dispensaries popping up all over the state with people coming from all over to get a fix.

Maybe he would like to live next to one. I understand he smokes. But many people in New Jersey would rather not.

Lem said...

Hey bags, cool avatar pic.

Icepick said...

You say Colorado and I think asses of fire and Saddam's sex toy collection. So no, I don't want to go to Colorado.

Also, Florida or Germany has been a fun party game for years, so NJ isn't the only state name that's a joke. For that matter, California, West Virginia, Illinois, Arkansas and Louisiana are all one or two word punch lines. As are Texas and Alaska in parts of the country, or New York and Massachusetts in other areas.

Lem said...

The money that was supposed to be generated by the casinos seems to have never materialized. If it did then it has been stolen.
If you go to the outskirts of Atlantic City, it has not benefit one bit.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Christie's a cunt. And New Jersey's reputation is really a lot worse, on the whole, than Colorado's. If it weren't for its bordering New York City no one would care about the place. It's essentially like any other part of American suburbia, no different - other than for "the shore" - and we can see what the exposure of that non-entity means to MTV viewers. Atlantic City has none of the allure of Las Vegas.

But they do think it's grand to elect a gargantuan governor who tells his constituents to "shut up" and calls them "idiot" when they disagree with him too strongly. Yes, the state has that going for them.

No other state would elect such an ass. That alone tells you what New Jersey doesn't understand about itself vis-a-vis the rest of America - including the pot issue for which the population in favor of legalization just surpassed 50%.

Seriously. Expand gambling, fortify against a natural chemical mellow. What priorities.

Oh, and he also fought tooth and nail to prevent families with kids having hundreds of seizures a day from receiving the only medicine that would stop them. He's just a sick person.

But, you know. New Jersey. Again, the people on the whole over there aren't that bad or different from America. It's just a question of what they tolerate. They think their state's politics were so irrevocably corrupt that they honestly see this bulvon as the only improvement. How pathetic.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

You say Colorado and I think asses of fire and Saddam's sex toy collection. So no, I don't want to go to Colorado.

Lol. Tell us what you really think, Icepick! I mean, seriously, if I actually understood more of what you meant by this I must believe it would be a truly interesting thing to know what other ideas you entertain yourself with.

Aren't you a military guy? A "rugged conservative"? Colorado's got NORAD and some awesome outdoors rec going for it. That alone (apart from Chip and April living there) must make it pretty hard for anyone to actually hate.

Lydia said...

Is it just me, or does bagoh's new avatar photo look like this guy?

Sixty Grit said...

Reminds me of the line from Animal House "The wimp and the blimp".

I side with neither of them. But I think they make a lovely couple.

Chip Ahoy said...

I guess we're like Amsterdam used to be.

Having all the visitors is nice.

Directly across the street, Broadway, there is a hostel that I did not know about. I thought they were 2nd 3rd story apartments above the shops.

Until I noticed youngsters emerging in freezing weather without coats. That happens. People are not used to such dry air, the moisture key in signaling cold. Step out, feel nothing, walk for a block or so before it hits you that it's freezing outside.

The fat ones take longer. Back and forth up and down in and out the door without coats. Europeans.

I checked out only two such dispensaries. Both very nice. Not at all like headshops. Christie knows not of which he speaks. But that doesn't stop the cow speaking.

In one of the shops is a large US map that takes up nearly the whole wall. It is titled, "Show us where you're from." Pins stuck in map cover the entire thing, thousands of pins in clusters. All Around the edges of the map covering the borders are pins with tiny pieces of paper with names of countries on them. Cute. They wanted to show they come from all over the world.

The tiny grocery store at the corner next door to the hostel I use often, they all know me, I noticed has its own miniature head shop, a glass case with a shelf of paraphernalia.

Directly across the street, beneath my apartment is a liquor store!!!11!1111!111 And, man, does it do the business.

AllenS said...

Bags, if he didn't live so far from me, would be someone I'd like to drink beer with.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Christie thought it was a complicated and difficult matter to agree to prevent a child from dying of suffocation.

That alone should disqualify him from being taken seriously by anyone.

Seriously, the guy's a toot. A cunt. A wreck. Why hasn't his fucking gastric bypass started working yet? What is wrong with him?

Chip Ahoy said...

It's good to see Sullivan apparently recovered from his Palin vagina fear obsession too bad he cannot be regarded seriously after all that.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

If I were in his shape I'd try avoiding phrases like "slippery slope" (apparently, his favorite) as it brings to mind images of greased poles and and other greased objects in close proximity to his less clothed mass.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Lol. What do you think of vaginas, Chip?

deborah said...

For quite a while bags has reminded me of this guy:

DF

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Chris Christie has bad experiences with slippery slopes. He once fell face forward and slid twenty feet on a 5 degree incline on an icy Manhattan road.

It scarred him for life.

He's been careful to avoid such things ever since.

deborah said...

It's the same as the STATE casinos in Ohio. Money, money, money, money muh-ney.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Bags is better looking than Dennis Farina. Especially in that picture. The guy's face looks like a bowling ball bag. Not nice, Debbie.

Tell him he looks like Magnum P.I. Plus, he lives closer to Hawaii than most of us anyway.

bagoh20 said...

Thanks Lem. That's me and Hugo at our dog adoption event last week. He's a big Pit Bull / Visla mix with one eye. I tried to get him to wear a patch like a pirate, but it just won't stay on.

He lost his eye as a puppy when a very cruel woman kept him in a tiny cage too small for him to even stand up. I don't know how she took out his eye, but she ended up with 6 months in jail and a $10,000 fine (the maximum penalty). That's how we ended up with him in our rescue. He needed surgery and physical therapy to get his legs to work right after being cramped up for his whole puppyhood. Now he's very happy, free, and runs like the wind. At night I let him chase these guys below who live behind my house. In the dark, he can't find them because they are so smart and him with one eye, well they just stand motionless as he runs right by.

Smooth Criminals

AllenS said...

Who in the fuck would drink a beer with Rhythm and Balls? Nobody.
R and B. Do you know anyone on this blog? A lot of us know each other, how about you?

You are nothing but a drive-by.

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...

And New Jersey's reputation is really a lot worse, on the whole, than Colorado's.

Only because people don't realize anybody you meet from CO is a head case.

bagoh20 said...

"You say Colorado and I think asses of fire and Saddam's sex toy collection"

But honestly, don't you think about that about a hundred times a day, so don't blame Colorado. You just have an active libido - NTTIATWWT

Chip Ahoy said...

This guy's on my nob again. Do you see it? It's a thing I learned to deal, dudes latching on, following me around, ignoring rebuffs, constantly provoking for my attention, trying to bugger me and trying harder to get me to bugger them back. I cannot step out the door without some dude on my nob and it's ever been thus. What's a guy to do but shrug. They're everywhere.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Who in the fuck would drink a beer with Rhythm and Balls? Nobody.

Lol. Someone with a better sense of humor and wit than you. But I'm not much a fan of drinking anyway. It's a pretty over-rated and dull vice.

I think it's pretty goofy that you'd try to make an IRL club out of this. Althouse tried it once. A few I've corresponded with off-line. Others I wouldn't have any reason to. Remember when you told Trooper he was too uncool to be associated with anything and anything but me?

Good times.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...
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Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

This guy's on my nob again. Do you see it?

No. I just thought it was hilarious that you proclaimed Sullivan eternally un-readable for expressing insufficient vagina-love for Sarah Palin. That was one of the funniest things I've heard, especially coming from you - and you say a lot of unintentionally funny things.

Which is even funnier considering how unimaginable it is to picture you ever smiling.

Smile, Chip! Candid camera!

Annoyance =/= attraction. Except for five-year olds.

deborah said...

Ritmo doesn't know what a good-looking man looks like :)

AllenS said...

Five year olds? Man, that's you.

AllenS said...

Or, girl. Sorry.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Ok Debbie but apparently Chip begs to differ. ;-)

Everyone should retain some childishness about them every now and then, Allen.

bagoh20 said...

Thanks Allen. I'm honored, and maybe someday we'll do it. Coincidently, if we met halfway it would be somehwere in Colorado, likely surrounded by old hippy chicks giggling, stoned and demanding pizza.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Oh neat-o! Gender confusion jokes. That's nothing a five-year old would do. ;-)

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
john said...

Indy Racing League?
Improvised Rocket Launcher?
In Real Life?

Tony makes the decisions about vices in New Jersey. Illegal is better. Christie plays along.

R&B is really putting a lot of hate on the guy, who is pretty much saying what 40+ other governors have or would say. Is he worried that Christie is going to run, and that he would actually clean up the floor against Hillary! in debate? I have no idea if either is true, but R&B really protests too much, and with such profanity.

bagoh20 said...

I live in the capital of weed dispensaries, and they don't ruin the neighborhood anywhere near as bad as a high school does, or even worse having Maxine Waters as your representative. "No justice - No Peace!"

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

I don't understand why people assume someone has to have an agenda to simply like or not like something or someone, John. I think feelings precede logic, usually.

Christie can say what other governors say, but that's an interesting angle given that no governor -- and I mean, no governor would ever huff off on a voter with a call of Idiot!. You know you agree with me on that.

That part of his "appeal" is strictly New Jersey-ish. Of course, he might change. But I doubt it.

It's for that reason that I think he's an ass. I tried having an open mind about him, and about that, and then realized there wasn't much more than that. Even Trooper thinks he's a bully.

And then you have bridge-gate and child-suffocation-from-epilepsy gate. (I know the latter I've inflated in terms of the "scandal" it raised, but to me it really does make him quite an evil ass. I'm funny about life and death matters like that).

In these regards, I suppose I could be unusual. Or they might really be much greater liabilities with many others than you suppose. All I know is it doesn't work for me. If America thinks it works for them, God help them. As the people of New Jersey (post-bridgegate) found out.

bagoh20 said...

Here is the question that nobody can answer about Hillary: What has she accomplished that recomends her as President?

What does that tell you about a Hillary Presidency? Can we afford another one of those after the 8 years we just wasted waiting for a recovery that should have taken off like a rocket 3 years ago at the latest just like every one before it?

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Here is the question that nobody can answer about Hillary: What has she accomplished that recomends her as President?

Nothing. Absolutely nothing. She's a symbol - more of one than Obama.

If Republicans can figure out what moderation means by 2016, I can promise you I'd vote for one of them. Whatever happened to inoffensive and respectable Republicans like Kay Bailey Hutchison, for instance? Not only has she accomplished more, she's a !woman!

If you can pull something like that, or admit that a guy like John Huntsman isn't evil, or get more R. Paul-types to question Republican orthodoxy, you'd have my vote against !Hillary!

I'd probably even vote for Sarah Palin over HIlary. Imagine that.

Open your mind a bit and you'll see an electorate willing to give you much greater things than you could probably imagine.

bagoh20 said...

And do we really want to spend 4 years with a President that can't be criticized or even questioned without citizens getting called sexist for it?

The last thing we need is another leader too delicate to be questioned by the Press or anyone else.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

The last thing we need is another leader too delicate to be questioned by the Press or anyone else.

Damn! And for a moment there you had me pulling for Sarah Palin over !Hillary!

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...

Here is the question that nobody can answer about Hillary: What has she accomplished that recomends her as President?

Nothing. Absolutely nothing. She's a symbol - more of one than Obama.

If Republicans can figure out what moderation means by 2016, I can promise you I'd vote for one of them.


Right.

Ritmo voted for Huntsman.

bagoh20 said...

I'm no fan of Christie, but at least a big fat pasty Republican can be properly vetted, and have his leadership honestly evaluated. Getting an objective or even adversarial Press is worth voting for any Repubican over a Democrat, and then if you throw in the woman or race card, such a person ruins the checks and balances and very nature of the American spirit of government.

I wish it wasn't like that, but that is what you get with such a candidate - a lot is lost by all sides.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

ed seems confused.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

I think one of the main differences are:

In the main, people who go to casinos to stay, gamble or for an event of some sort will be employed people or retired people. They have discretionary income, have respect for property, don't piss in the streets, loiter, litter and in general do not make an annoyance of themselves. Not only do the patrons contribute to the general tax revenue, there are a lot of ancillary jobs that benefit from casino patrons. Tips for waitresses, bartenders, cab drivers, impulse purchases at stores. There are always exceptions to that rule, but I would imagine that the New Jersey police, like the Reno Police (toughest police force in the world) make a swift resolution to trouble makers.

On the other hand. Pot stores attract nuisance people. Little to no money, if you are concerned about the taxes and the local economic benefits. It attracts minors who want to be cool. The patrons loiter around impeding other businesses, litter and in general dirty up the place. Are generally low life types. Don't contribute to the local economy and have no respect for the working general public or businesses in the area.

Plus they stink.

I can say this having been a participant in BOTH groups in my life :-)

bagoh20 said...

Avoiding any more affirmative action Presidents is the absolute best way to vote for symbolism - the symbolism of a healthy nation willing and able to honestly judge it's leaders.

bagoh20 said...

The election of Obama and his subsequent failure to perform and total failure to advance race relations has been the best symbolism any white supremist could have hoped for. Symbols can fail or backfire. Choose them carefully. Here's an idea: pick someone - symbolic or not - that is competent and proven, then it's a win all around.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Wow. It looks like Christie couldn't have dug himself a deeper hole with all the comments on the CNN piece.

Nice job, Governor Soprano.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Of course, I'm basing my perceptions on the Medical Marijuana (what a joke) stores in California and what I know in my first hand experience of pot heads.

Maybe legalization gives the whole thing a better luster and attracts a better class of clientele. Just like Prohibition speakeasies versus nice legal cocktail lounges.

edutcher said...

Wasn't Huntsman the Great Moderate Republican Even Lefties Could Love?

As always, Ritmo runs for cover.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Wow Bunny. I guess we can say from your 8:04 comment that you've either never been to Colorado or New Jersey or don't know all that much about the relative cleanliness of each.

Imagining a Camden Colorado or an Aspen or Boulder, New Jersey is giving me shits and giggles greater than any high ever could.

deborah said...

Hillary is praying it will be Christie.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

ed, be sure not to tell your wife what you think or love about Abby Huntsman.

Especially now that she contributes to MSNBC.

Whip!

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...
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Dust Bunny Queen said...

That's me and Hugo at our dog adoption event last week. He's a big Pit Bull / Visla mix with one eye. I tried to get him to wear a patch like a pirate, but it just won't stay on.

There is a place in Heaven for you and people who do your work. A place in Hell for that woman and her ilk. Hell is too good, actually.




Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

I think Hillary! could beat Gov. Soprano, Deb. Think of how much easier it would be for her to suddenly appear gracious than it would be for him.

Think of how much easier it would be for her to appear thoughtful than it would be for him.

Think of how much easier it is for her to suppress her urge to call a reporter or voter an "IDIOT!" than it is for --

Well, I repeat myself.

bagoh20 said...

I know people who own and frequent pot dispensaries. Most are basically middle aged, middle class, and responsible people especially the ones doing as a business. The customers run the gammit, from normal moms and dads to wasted youth, but I'd say the ones using the dispensaries are primarily mainstrream, and responsible, with a big dose of slackers who live off government largess - like non-disabled disabiltiy, endless unemployement, or bogus lawsuits, but that's not only potheads living like that.

I'd like to use pot, but I can't afford any loss of IQ points, even if temporary.

john said...

I'd probably even vote for Sarah Palin over HIlary. Imagine that.

You and [] lifted a few too many, I would say. But cheers.

I might have supported Huntsman. He's from Utah, and he's a Mormon. Excitable Andy would have had a big hardon about his magic underwea, Funny, he doesn't write about Harry Reid that way, although even Andy probably wouldn't fantasize about Harry's underwear.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Wow Bunny. I guess we can say from your 8:04 comment that you've either never been to Colorado or New Jersey or don't know all that much about the relative cleanliness of each.

I've been to Colorado, hunting and camping.

Actually, pretty much any urban area is the same to me Colorado or New Jersey.....shitty. Maybe Colorado a bit less so. More clean air, most of the time. The rural areas of Colorado are beautiful. I understand that there are some nice areas of New Jersey outside of the urban cesspools. Atlantic city is likely a cesspool. Areas of Reno are pretty crappy too. I can only judge the Casino districts based on what I know, Las Vegas and Reno. Both are very scrupulous about keeping things clean and in order in the tourist areas. The pot meccas of California: they are about on the level of an airplane barf bag that leaks all over the place. That also includes San Francisco, my previous stomping grounds.

My point is that if you want to build a tax base, revenue source, the casino model is much more lucrative than the pot model. More people and businesses benefit from the casino model than the marijuana model.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for legalization. I could give a rip what people want to do and it probably is better, both economically and on a social level, to legalize a soft core drug like marijuana, just like alcohol.

But....economically. Tax revenue to the government. That's another issue.

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...

ed, be sure not to tell your wife what you think or love about Abby Huntsman.

Especially now that she contributes to MSNBC.

Whip!


Haven't heard such gay repartee since Ben Stein appeared in "Ferris Bueller".

Synova said...

Let Colorado continue on for a decade and prove the concept...

Rabel said...

It's clear to me that Christie knows his New Jerseyans pretty well. Doesn't anybody here watch South Park.

The knock on Colorado was just deflection. What could he say, "We don't want these idiots here any more fucked up than they already are. They can't even pump their own gas!" So he took a dump on Colorado.

I drove through Jersey once. They charged me 9 dollars to go across a bridge. Those bastards. I'll get even one day.

I apologize for any unpleasant mental imagery the Christie taking a dump statement may have caused.

I also apologize to any blog hosts who are rightfully offended by my taking a dump on Jersey.

Rabel said...

And as far as Ritmo's citation that Christie is killing kids, why doesn't the dickhead who claims that his daughter is "dying a little more every day" pack up and move?

I guess he's got his priorities.

deborah said...

I don't know, DBQ, just seems to me that gambling is more pervasive and broadly damaging to the social fabric. People just love to throw their money away on it.

Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

edutcher said...
Haven't heard such gay repartee since ...


Ooohhh! Ed said 'gay', hehe....

Lem said...

Let Colorado continue on for a decade and prove the concept...

Right... the rule of thumb is you don't want to rush out to buy a brand new car model... you want to wait until they recalled all the kinks out, the mistakes that can never be fully predicted on the drawing board.

deborah said...

Ritmo:
"Think of how much easier it would be for her to appear thoughtful than it would be for him."

I await the first Rick Lazio moment. The media will be aghast.

Lem said...

You want pot? Proceed with caution.

deborah said...

I agree, Lem. The states work best as laboratories of democracy. But I imagine many states will jump on board quickly.

sakredkow said...

Right... the rule of thumb is you don't want to rush out to buy a brand new car model... you want to wait until they recalled all the kinks out, the mistakes that can never be fully predicted on the drawing board.

A decade is a little much to wait I think. And I don't know really if it's rushing when we've been throwing people in jails and prisons for decades for simple possession.

I'm okay with decriminalization first, if we're talking real decriminalization, including decriminalizing small-time marijuana dealers. You got to be able to get the stuff from some place.

Lem said...

I'm also not impressed by Sullivan's rush to use the word prejudice to buck up his argument.

I think Sullivan abuses the concept.

Lem said...

Not everything a people decide against is prejudice... and to label it so is pernicious.

edutcher said...

AnUnreasonableTroll said...

Haven't heard such gay repartee since ...

Ooohhh! Ed said 'gay', hehe....


Troll proves yet again he reached his intellectual peak with "Beavis And Butthead".

chickelit said...

deborah said...
I agree, Lem. The states work best as laboratories of democracy. But I imagine many states will jump on board quickly.

You'd think California would, but not under Jerry Brown.

BTW, why didn't people like Ritmo and Sullivan go after him in the same way as Christie? The obvious answer is political party.

chickelit said...

edutcher said...

Troll proves yet again he reached his intellectual peak with "Beavis And Butthead".

This is excellent chirbit fodder...

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

And as far as Ritmo's citation that Christie is killing kids, why doesn't the dickhead who claims that his daughter is "dying a little more every day" pack up and move?

I guess he's got his priorities.


Yeah, like a job, you silly c-word.

In case you haven't heard, it's a tough economy right now. Not everyone is entitled enough to think jobs grow on trees. Give me a break.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

BTW, why didn't people like Ritmo and Sullivan go after him in the same way as Christie? The obvious answer is political party.

Yep. It's the protective power of the donkey on the flag instead of the elephant. Not his classy refusal to badmouth constituents, not his classy refusal to surround himself with pinheads who think of closing roads to disrupt infrastructure as a form of political payback.

Did you know that people could actually be judged by their actions? Would that be a novel concept? Would it disrupt some over-riding goal of partisan balance uber everything?

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

The obvious answer is political party.

The answer is California's already done enough to prove how much more progressive it is on this and a whole host of other things than has the armpit of America and its chief resident, Governor Christie. It led the way for a long time. And Brown's comments were a bit gentle; he never threatened to be the forever-block against something like that, should Californians choose to do so. So, in other words, he differs from Christie in this regard in the same way he does on everything else: by being a hard-working leader instead of someone who constantly pits himself in a rhetorical and ideological war against his own voters.

The two of them could say the same thing and Christie would manage to bully people with it while Brown would make it sound like a gentle request. Trust Trooper on this - Christie's just a bully. It's what the people there thought they wanted. The issues are obviously important, but unfortunately end up being secondary to that.

chickelit said...

Trust Trooper on this - Christie's just a bully.

Troop can abide and thrive alongside the next NJ Dem governor elected because of animosity towards Christie for all I care. I'm far far away from there.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

I await the first Rick Lazio moment. The media will be aghast.

Well, for whatever reason, if a woman - as is her right - is less willing to make aggressive physical maneuvers in a debate or trial of the political sort, it's probably smart to oblige and not challenge that way. I seem to recall people affiliated with this crowd at TOP talking about how "weird" Al Gore was to approach W. during their 2000 debates about whether he'd support the "Dingle-Norwood bill".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAUcyfKESts

Doesn't seem much different. W. got a chance to handle it differently, but to the same effect.

Asking for a little more classiness on the part of the candidates' behavior toward one another need not be a bad thing - whatever the reason.

chickelit said...

I never -- for a second -- thought Christie had national appeal. My record at Althouse speaks for that.

Christie may however be the best for NJ.

Who else do you have in mind for NJ, R&B?

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

I'm sure I can't do much to help NJ.

Cultures are what they are.

I first liked this place when I moved here - or just slightly south of it.

Now I'm convinced it's a cesspool. I prefer the west.

New England's nice - but I think my philosophy's centering more around an appreciation for a nice natural environment, and how that improves the mindset of people living within (and taking care of) it.

NJ has a few simple claims to fame:

1. Proximity to NYC.
2. A questionably recreationally accessible shoreline. (Some of the beach towns are nicer than others).
3. A "gamblin' town" that did what Vegas did before Vegas got waaayyyyy better at it.
4. A take-no-bullshit attitude - despite seeming to tolerate an awful lot of it.

None of these things, in themselves, do much of anything for me any more, if ever they did. I'm not a gambler (lost that bug with my first professional degree) and we can see what MTV did for the appeal of just any shore (in which medical waste used to wash up regularly) and attitude.

There's a sense of social warfare south of NYC that I'm tired of. I think rational people get to a point where they prefer harmony.

If you want, as a follow-up, my take on the advantages (and disadvantages?) of other places, I'm sure I've spouted off on them many a time before, but could expand on it again.

But my point is, I just got back here Friday from a week away, and the bs started not ten minutes before landing. The contrast to what I enjoyed couldn't have been starker. And I'm pretty close to done with it.

Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...

Sorry about the double posts. It's the electronics, not me.

deborah said...

Ritmo, I just looked at the Hillary/Lazio tape. I had remembered it a bit differently. He's just a little too aggressive and pushy. She stands her ground graciously (right after taunting him). She did not back down or take offence. The action is in the first two minutes:

Hillary/Lazio

Icepick said...

I mean, seriously, if I actually understood more of what you meant by this I must believe it would be a truly interesting thing to know what other ideas you entertain yourself with.

It was a reference to South Park. But then I wouldn't expect you to know anything about anything, so it's no surprise you don't know about Matt and Trey. You are, after all, the most ignorant and the most stupid person I have ever dealt with on the internet. And that includes the 13 year-old from back in the 1990s that was threatening to rape my wife.

Icepick said...

But honestly, don't you think about that about a hundred times a day, so don't blame Colorado.

Not really. Only when I think of South Park, and talk of Colorado always reminds me of South Park.

Icepick said...

It's good to see that one other person here is familiar with South Park. Figures it would be Rabel, who seems to know a fair amount about everything.

Icepick said...

You just have an active libido - NTTIATWWT

Not as active as it used to be, alas. Time pushes us all along to the grave.

But I think it was Eric the Fruit Bat who mentioned that one benefit of lessened libido was that that other person who had been shouting in his ears for all those decades was finally starting to tone things down. Just getting to where I think the decibel level has come down a few points.

Icepick said...

you want to wait until they recalled all the kinks out

Unless it's a GM car. By the time they get recalled they're two redesigns along.

Icepick said...

And people don't get thrown in jail for simple possession, else-wise many millions more would be in jail. People get thrown in jail for simple possession when the police believe they're guilty of something else but can't prove THAT, so they charge them on possession charges.

At this point in my life I know people that have been smoking dope regularly for decades, and the only problems they've had with police are the same ones most people have: The occasional speeding or parking ticket. Never been busted for drugs, probably never will be. But then, they largely lead quiet lives away from the criminal element (other than their dealers, of course), and the police just don't bother to take notice of them.

On the other hand, if the cops pull you over and you've got a bunch of gang tats visible, they'll go out of their way to see what you might be up to that isn't strictly on the level.

Unknown said...

Ritmo and I are in agreement that Christie would lose to Hillayr.

Why no way in hell we should allow the establishment to select Chris Christie as the nom.
We need a young well spoken libertarian type to win the day.

Icepick said...

Troll proves yet again he reached his intellectual peak with "Beavis And Butthead".

Beavis & Butt-head was a brilliant show, ed. The point wasn't that B&B were idiots who did idiotic things. The point was that so many of their "betters" were just as bad, but in different ways.

Icepick said...

Mike Judge has been a very perceptive man, and that actually shown through on B&B as well as in many of his other productions. You just have to get past the fart jokes. And the boob jokes. And the pee jokes. Uh, and frog baseball.

Well, there's good stuff there, even if everyone can't get through the other stuff.

Unknown said...

Agree with Synova. It's too early to tell if legal pot is a good thing in CO. So far the tax revenue is much lower than projected, despite what the narrative pimpers in the unprofessional lair hack press say.
I voted to legalize, but I'm not a fan of the stuff personally.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Why no way in hell we should allow the establishment to select Chris Christie as the nom.
We need a young well spoken libertarian type to win the day.


Agreed. Christie, while entertaining and fun to watch him call out the dopes in this world, would lose lose lose. The youth are disenchanted with the Demos right now and would definitely lean towards a libertarian style of candidate.

I'm all for legalizing pot for several reasons.

First. There are many recreational users who have been charged and put into jail who are just not criminals at all. It is a huge waste of time, money and ruins people for no good reason.

Second. Legalizing the growth and sale of the product would get the actual criminal elements out of our wilderness areas. The damage that they do to the environment is horrible and they are a REAL danger to people who just want to hike or even take a day trip in the forests.

Third. Instead of spending police time and efforts on a relatively harmless substance, we could then focus on the real threats of Meth production, which is even worse for the environment. And limit the use of this horrible drug that destroys people. Literally destroys them

bagoh20 said...

I'm also for legalization, but for the simple reason that it should never have been made illegal in the first place. There just isn't any good justification, and that's first principles. After that, there are a basketful of bad consequences for making such a thing illegal.

Unknown said...

Agreed Bagoh and DBQ. I'm no expert on the psychology but it seems to me there is also the mystique factor.
People want to do things they are told they cannot do. That's why underage drinking and smoking pot with Julio in the schoolyard is so fun. It's illegal!

Sixty Grit said...

Whoa, dude, it's like I just had to right this comment or something...

Sixty Grit said...

"right"? Dude, are you high or sumpin'?

Trooper York said...

This is a tough one for me. Sullivan or Christie. Iraq or Iran. Hitler or Stalin.

Trooper York said...

I don't dislike Christie because he is a bully. Some of our best Presidents have been bullies. I dislike him because he is the Rhinoest of Rhinos. If you like hom you might as well elect a Democrat.

Trooper York said...

Sorry. Posting on a phone. My bad.

bagoh20 said...

Yea, you missed the second "O",...

but, that happens at your age. Just sayin'.