Monday, September 16, 2013

“This is nasty business”

"‘Are you sexually active? If so, with one partner, multiple partners or same-sex partners?”
Be ready to answer those questions and more the next time you go to the doctor, whether it’s the dermatologist or the cardiologist and no matter if the questions are unrelated to why you’re seeking medical help. And you can thank the Obama health law."
Doctors and hospitals who don’t comply with the federal government’s electronic-health-records requirements forgo incentive payments now; starting in 2015, they’ll face financial penalties from Medicare and Medicaid. The Department of Health and Human Services has already paid out over $12.7 billion for these incentives.
Dr. Richard Amerling, a nephrologist and associate professor at Albert Einstein Medical College, explains that your medical record should be “a story created by you and your doctor solely for your treatment and benefit.” But the new requirements are turning it “into an interrogation, and the data will not be confidential.”
The social-history questions also include whether you’ve ever used drugs, including IV drugs. As the NYCLU cautioned, revealing a patient’s past drug problem, even if it was a decade ago, risks stigma.
The administration is ignoring these protests from privacy advocates. On Jan. 17, HHS announced patients who want to keep something out of their electronic record should pay cash. That’s impractical for most people.
There’s one question they can’t ask: Thanks to the NRA, Section 2716 of the ObamaCare law bars the federal government from compelling doctors and hospitals to ask you if you own a firearm.
But that’s the only question they can’t be told to ask you.
New York Post

82 comments:

Shouting Thomas said...

In an abstract way, I can get into the privacy issues.

The reality is that privacy is impossible in the digital age. When you turn on that computer, you haven't just created a window out into the world, you've created a window into your home and mind.

Once info is digitized and stored somewhere, it's available to anybody who's got the technical knowledge necessary to break through the firewalls and harvest it.

Joe Biden, America's Putin said...

The president’s “reforms” aim to turn doctors into government agents, pressuring them financially to ask questions they consider inappropriate and unnecessary, and to violate their Hippocratic Oath to keep patients’ records confidential.

Joe Biden, America's Putin said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

As a part of a checkup it is a prudent thing for a doctor to ask, but what is troubling is mandate tracking this information by the government. In a broad statistical way, I do not have a problem with it. But my worry is it will tie back to individuals somehow.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

Didn't they start by getting the doctors to identify the mental incompetents?

Just asking.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

I decline to answer

I decline to answer

I decline to answer

Learn it, love it, live it.

Only problem is when it affects your care.

Leland said...

I know the left's favorite boogie man is President Reagan. So imagine the outcry if Reagan had created a national database to store personal information and then used the force of the federal government to enlist doctor's to populate that database with this information: "Are you sexually active? If so, with one partner, multiple partners or same-sex partners?”

I've been asked these questions many times, because I'm a regular blood donor. So they are not much of a shock to me. What will be a shock, as Evi notes, is how this information will be utilized by the federal government. I'm asked the questions because increased sexual activity, multiple partners, and homosexuality are considered increased risks for disease.

Leland said...

Didn't they start by getting the doctors to identify the mental incompetents?

"Do you masturbate or pay for sex?"

Oh sorry, I suspect you mean the draconian acts that used to go on in the United States as people were forced into "institutions" for their own mental health. Now those people attempt to get degrees in psychology in Colorado until the breakdown and shoot up movie theaters. But yes, they used to have doctors identify them, and now they don't.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

Godwin wept.

sakredkow said...

You! You made Godwin cry!

AllenS said...

If you think that the questions are inappropriate, think about what the best answer will be, and say it. Who cares if it's a lie. Obama's whole life is a lie, and he's the POTUS.

Meade said...

"I've been asked these questions many times, because I'm a regular blood donor."

Same here and I find the questions somewhat reassuring. They also ask me if I've been outside the US or Canada in the past 3 years, spent time in the UK between 1980 and 1996 (mad cow), or been in Africa or had sex with anyone who was born in or lived in Africa.

Now if they start asking me about my religious faith or if I've ever attended a Tea Party gathering or a gathering of any organization with the words "liberty" or "limited government" in its title, I'll begin to worry.

Leland said...

You should be fine unless you file to be an exempt organization that doesn't support abortion or thinks the government should spend and tax less.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Don't worry; the gay lobby is hard at work to get those hatey-hate bigoty questions removed from the blood donation process. Google gays and blood donation.

test said...

If the feds drive access to medical histories it'll become routine for some helpful apparatchik to out any Republican who had an abortion or an STD. One little side benefit to those pushing Obamacare.

Meade said...

Have you ever googled or had sexual relations with someone who has googled, even one (1) time, "gays_blood_donations"?

Icepick said...

Just answer "YES" or "69" to every question, as appropriate.

bagoh20 said...

I learned a while back that you must often lie to the medical system to save your own life. The bureaucracy already had pockets of brainless and cruel, but now with the ACA it will be the over-arching principle in play.

People don't want to hurt you, but they have rules to follow, and they aren't going to lose their job for you, even if it kills you. The government has a magical way of making us enemies of one another.

Aridog said...

"‘Are you sexually active? If so, with one partner, multiple partners or same-sex partners?”

Dang...AllenS beat me to it, in principle...

Presuming they already know my age of 70 and basic vitals, the easy answers are:

Sexually Active? Check - Yes! But down to three times per day now.

How many partners? Check - A dozen or so.

Gender of Partner? Check - I prefer teh ladies.

Now those are as good answers as the one I gave my local hospital clinic for my "race" on a new questionaire recently. I entered "Homo Erectus."

My background with databases informs me that so long as something gets filled in to "mandatory" fields, you will be good to go 99% of the time ... and funny entries really mess up
designated field queries.

Methadras said...

Urkel wants to know who and how many people you are porking for your health. Thanks Urkel.

sakredkow said...

All this and Death Squads, too. Shaking my head...

test said...

phx said...
All this and Death Squads, too. Shaking my head...


That's death panels.

Isn't it interesting the left is still mocking things that are actually in the law? It's like reality doesn't even enter their analysis.

bagoh20 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bagoh20 said...

I have noticed a marked negative trend with the service from my medical providers over the last year. After using the same medical group for over a decade, suddenly it's impossible to get in or to get anything done. It's a freaking maze of firewalls now which seem designed to get you to give up the whole idea of seeing your doctor. I've heard the same from other people with different doctors.

They have done the age-old bureaucratic trick of creating all these "ways to serve you, and improve access", but of course none of them really work and are just dead ends. The primary characteristic of bureaucracy is lack of service - both intended and unintended, and both are identical in effect to the victims of them. From insurance to doctors to information, it all has taken a major turn for the worst over the last year.

Of course proponent will say it's just the beginning, and problems will be fixed, but we have all been here before, and the solutions will be worse and much worse than nothing. They always are. The only people who will be willing to go through it, will be those with all day to run their frauds, because that will be their jobs. The rest of us have other jobs that take our time.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

‘Are you sexually active? If so, with one partner, multiple partners or same-sex partners?”

Do the sheep count?

Some questions are relevant to your medical health, like smoking, drug use, how much whoring around you have done or are doing. Like Evi, I think it isn't any business of the Federal Government.

Our local clinic had a questionnaire for us to fill out that had a lot of mental health questions. "Have you ever thought of suicide." "Are you often, sometimes, never depressed" etc. I asked why and they said because they are getting government grants for subsidizing this rural clinic that they had to show that there may be a need for those services. Now....I don't mind letting them get the grant because I'm sure that there are some depressed people around. GOD knows I'm depressed when I think about Obama and what is happening to our country. I might be inclined to skew the results by lying, but not if it is going to go onto MY record in the keeping of Big Brother.

Allen is right. Just tell a lie.

edutcher said...

And, of course, all this intimate information, taken by "navigators" (translation: budding community organizers (translation: ACORN alumni)) will be kept strictly confidential.

Icepick said...

I'm sure the government will handle their tasks with all the tact and discretion with which they've run the IRS and NSA in recent years.

deborah said...

I was talking with someone yesterday that said Obamcare was much needed. She cited her dental hygienest, who she assumes makes $30-40/hr., and said she isn't insured by the dentist. I said that's a pretty good paycheck, can't she afford her own? My interlocutor replied that that would probably be $1200/mo. What say ye?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

My interlocutor replied that that would probably be $1200/mo. What say ye?

As a 20 year + licensed insurance agent I say buying dental insurance is stupid.....unless you know you are going to have major work done, have children who need orthodontics. The cost of buying dental insurance is often more costly than the routine check ups and occasional work that might be needed. Pay cash and pocket the difference into a savings account.

Also as a 20 year + insurance agent, who is now in the process of yet another renewal of the license, there is NO way in Hell that you are going to get any kind of informed advice from those government "navigators". The minimal amount of training that they are getting in a VERY complex industry is a joke.

Since they have no way to verify anything.....just lie.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Re the dental hygenist, it depends on what her Net is on her salary and how many dependents she has to cover and what her other debt load is. Mortgage, car pmts, car insurance, house insurance, liability insurance if she is self employed etc etc etc.

A $1200 a month bite for health insurance is a big deal. It is part of a house payment depending on where you live. Part of a rent payment. A car payment.

If you live in California and live in the Bay Area rent and housing is incredibly expensive. My daughter and her husband paid over $2000 a month for a flat in SF. Since then then have moved to a suburb and ONLY pay $1500 a month rent.

People should be allowed to choose the level of coverage that they need and not be forced to pay for coverage that they don't want or need.

bagoh20 said...

There is a craziness to many liberal minds that just assumes that people shouldn't have to pay for stuff themselves. The magical government will make it free somehow.

Even the intelligent ones have this defect when they assume that rich people can be taxed enough to cover things for everyone else and still this will not effect investment, hiring, and growth. The big effect they miss is how it mutes everyone's drive, top to bottom. Everyone on the ship rows a little slower, because they can and still get what they want, or they just don't see the payoff. Quietly the ship slows, and few notice as they proclaim "we are still moving!"

That's the real drain we are seeing in today's economy. Working hard to pay your own bills is now for suckers in all of Europe and the U.S.

We are in a period right now "post recession" that should be going gangbusters. Instead, it's pathetic, and my President just told me this morning that it's all good. The problem is he actually believes that. Just no imagination, or faith in his people. A very poor choice for a leader. He would make a decent college professor by today's standards.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

People should be allowed to choose the level of coverage that they need and not be forced to pay for coverage that they don't want or need.

Amen to that. I want to pay out of pocket for our routine stuff and sit down with our agent to put together a catastrophic care policy while considering breadth and depth of coverage, premiums and deductibles. I would like to stop paying $600 a month plus whatever my husband's employer is paying on our behalf for a policy that we use once a year for checkups. Why can't I do that, Obamacare?

sakredkow said...

Isn't it interesting the left is still mocking things that are actually in the law? It's like reality doesn't even enter their analysis.

A rightie still ranting about death panels. Give that man a megaphone.

bagoh20 said...

"A rightie still ranting about death panels."

It's not just righties. We all die and we are all subject to these bureaucrats. That includes you, and the people you love. I bet someday you too will be ranting about death panels, but it won't do any good. It will be too late.

sakredkow said...

Are we talking about the beaucracy of the health care system or are talking about death panels?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Are we talking about the beaucracy of the health care system or are talking about death panels?

"What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet."

Or in this case still stink to high heaven. A bunch of unelected bureaucrats getting together to come up with rules on who will be "allowed" treatment and who will be "allowed" to die by withholding treatment are serving the same function as a panel of people who make those same decisions. The end result....or the smell....is the same. Death by a decision made by a panel. Removing the Doctor and patient from the equation and making arbitrary rules on who lives and who dies.

The words or what you call it is really immaterial.....the result is the same. One term tries to hide the reality...the other cuts right to the chase.

test said...

phx said...
A rightie still ranting about death panels. Give that man a megaphone.


The left still doesn't know what's in the law. Someone tell Nancy passing it wasn't enough.

Are we talking about the beaucracy of the health care system or are talking about death panels?

Ever notice how the left just acts as if things they prefer not to acknowledge don't exist? "It clearly isn't a death panel because supporters don't call it one". It's a laziness that comes from never being challenged by anyone that doesn't share their worldview.

sakredkow said...

"It clearly isn't a death panel because supporters don't call it one".

No one's falling for that death panel! nonsense anymore - except those who still believe Sarah Palin will rescue the right. They hit the law of diminishing returns at this point. Everytime a rightie says "death panel!" it's another vote for the other side.

sakredkow said...

They're going to tie even moderate Republicans to the kooks on the right so tight they'll never come undone.

Say it loud, say it proud: Obamacare = Death Panels

Blame the "low information voters" {snicker}

test said...

phx said...
Everytime a rightie says "death panel!" it's another vote for the other side.


Clearly false since the left already has all the low information voters.

And note phx won't mention the IPAB board. Why admit the facts when your side controls the media? Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!

Dust Bunny Queen said...

No one's falling for that death panel! nonsense anymore

So....you are stating that there has not been established an The Independent Payment Advisory Board under Obamacare? The main function of this advisory board....or panel, is to cut Medicare spending and will be deciding what services will be covered and what will not be covered for 'certain groups' or demographic ages of clients.

Or that " the U.S. Preventive Services Task Force (that's a panel charged with reviewing evidence and making recommendations for preventive services) changed their guidance on best practices for screening women for breast cancer, suggesting that women in their 40s should not have annual mammograms and older women should reduce the use of this screening device."

When on the recommendation of this panel, your insurance will not cover you after a certain age for breast cancer screening even though your Doctor may feel you are at risk.....and you get cancer and die.....you don't think this panel has sentenced you to death.

Do you deny that another unelected flunky has been given the power of defining what kind of medical care we can have and who can have it? " Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius will determine the meaning of common medical and health insurance terms such as “hospitalization,” "physician services," “premium,” "prescription drug coverage," “deductible,” and “emergency room care.”

The provision giving the HHS secretary this power appears on pages 256 and 257 of the Finance Committee’s gargantuan health-care reform bill, which totals just over 1,500 pages.

“The Secretary of Health and Human Services,” says the bill, “shall, by regulations, provide for the development of standards for the definitions of terms used in health insurance coverage"

Sebelius, her official government position, can even decree who can get a transplant and who cannot, by just waiving her hands over some arbitrary rules of age or something, and can totally ignore the doctor's input on the individual case. If that isn't a death decision I don't know what else could be.

Just because they are not calling themselves "Death Panels" or wearing robes and carrying scythes doesn't mean that the result of these unelected bureaucratic groups of people who are making these sweeping impartial rules that will doom some to death or to longer lingering illnesses before dieing aren't in fact panels of death.

A rose is a rose is a rose.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

From Forbes: "IPAB takes the Medicare decision-making process away from doctors and away from Americans’ elected representatives in Congress and gives it to an unelected, unrepresentative and unaccountable advisory board. This panel is flawed and unethical–but it has total authority to make decisions regarding Medicare funding, how to implement spending cuts within the Medicare program, and how to allocate medical services.

Further, IPAB jeopardizes the quality of medical treatments and services for Medicare beneficiaries: proponents of IPAB argue that the program will improve care by reducing costs, but in reality, by advising such reduced spending per capita, IPAB can actually result in the denial of certain medical treatments, limiting services for seniors and Americans with disabilities.

Indeed, in removing doctors and elected officials from the decision-making process and replacing them with an unelected, unaccountable panel, IPAB is a threat to all Americans on Medicare."

Death panel? Yep.

Icepick said...

Everytime a rightie says "death panel!" it's another vote for the other side.

And that's all that matters.

bagoh20 said...

Someday, your elderly mother will ask you why the government won't let her doctor help her after she paid premiums and taxes her whole life.


You can tell her it's because "No one's falling for that death panel! nonsense anymore - except those who still believe Sarah Palin will rescue the right."

And she'll ask "what the hell is wrong with you, son."

You can say "I really hated that Sarah Palin, and Mom, I just wasn't thinking about you or anyone else at the time.

bagoh20 said...

DBQ, that's all great info and very serious, but did you know Sarah Palin kills baby wolves for fun. Now what do you think?

Icepick said...

More to the point, it has been over three and a half years since the legislation passed, and the government has been delaying implementation of this and that all summer long. Implementation is going to take longer than it took the US & Allies to defeat the Axis after Pearl Harbor was attacked.

But, naturally, phx has no problem with this kind of massive failure of basic administrative functions. Nor does any other Democrat. Every thing Obama has ever done has been the most successful thing in the history of things to these people, and there's no arguing otherwise.

Aridog said...

phx said...

Are we talking about the bureaucracy of the health care system or are [we] talking about death panels?

Call them what you want. I've been a bureaucrat and I know how it works, repeat I've been there, done that.

Said "panels" or "boards" or "Contracted Administrators" like CMS, will apply purely statistical best practices in their opinions (not medical doctors) and permit or disallow your treatment accordingly.

Try being 70+ and being sent to Physical Therapy by Sports Medicine Orthopedic doctors for something like encapsulitis of the shoulders. You will receive v-e-r-y cursory treatment for a maximum of 9 or so sessions (intake eval, interim eval, and final eval sessions do count as "therapy"...they just get billed like it) then be told you are not progressing enough to satisfy Medicare (which you have no choice about remember) and you will be discharged forthwith.

No matter that you were in fact progressing, there are limits on treatment that decrease with age.

If you are lucky, like I am, and know how to proceed without the PT drones, you can recover your range of motion & strength on your own. If you don't know the drill(s) then you are fucked..you will get no help, Medicare says so.

Actually Medicare didn't say shit, the treatment facility is merely "afraid" they won't get paid, if they proceed past the 9 (aka 12 sessions) and that you won't pay them if Medicare, & your supplemental provider, says no.

See...Bureaucrats made these "rules" and everyone down low in the provider chain will follow then on the safe side, for them, NOT YOU.

Think I am kidding? I just went through it...you want to see the documents?

Hint: If you are ever asked about pain under the new regime, never say 5 or less...the new regime will wonder why you are even bothering them. I have a high tolerance for pain, thanks to cervical injuries going back decades, dilaudid defying, morphine defying pain, pain than can make you faint while taking a piss. I has all happened to me. In short, my "5" is most folks' "10" most likely...but I had to learn not say that.

sakredkow said...

And note phx won't mention the IPAB board.

We weren't talking IPAB boards. We were talking Death Panels!

As in "Ever notice how the left just acts as if things they prefer not to acknowledge don't exist? 'It clearly isn't a death panel because supporters don't call it one.'" - Marshal @3:59.

I'm just saying, you're a "high information voter" - you tell us they're Death Panels.

That's good.

Icepick said...

For God's sake, don't call them Death PANELS. Call them Death ADVISORY BOARDS, wingers!

bagoh20 said...

I like "Cost Control Committee for the People" (CCCP)

sakredkow said...

You guys can't help yourselves! Death panels it is. Say it loud, say it proud.

This is why we can't have nice things.

KCFleming said...

Not your best argument, phx.
Not even in the top 25.

Methadras said...

PHX, can you tell me why the Affordable Healthcare Act was necessary to begin with?

test said...

Blogger phx said...
You guys can't help yourselves! Death panels it is. Say it loud, say it proud.

This is why we can't have nice things.


One wonders whether phx has ever asked himself his favorite question: what does he bring to the conversation that's constructive? Obviously the answer is nothing, that's not the point. The point is why doesn't he hold himself to the same standards he applies to the lowest wingers like us?

It's a tacit admission he knows even those he despises the most are better people than he. Is must suck to have so little life prospects the best use of your time is being an asshole on the internet.

Icepick said...

Well, if Obama doesn't call them death panels, then they can't be death panels.

Just like if Obama says he didn't say it was a red line, then it wasn't a red line, unless it was the world's red line, or it's Obama's new red line for Iran, or whatever.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

but did you know Sarah Palin kills baby wolves for fun. Now what do you think?

That is just horrible. They aren't even good to eat and the baby wolves are much too small to have their pelts sewn together to make a good fur coat. Way too many seams.

test said...

baby wolves are much too small to have their pelts sewn together to make a good fur coat

Gloves.

sakredkow said...

Pogo, Methadras, old opponents of mine, you come to put me in my place with respect.

I think your cause is better served by retiring the "death panels" canard.

A lot of people can't hear your good arguments when they're couched in that kind of dishonesty.

But I'll curb my impulsive tongue and listen to either of your counterarguments with respect. You've earned the right from me to take you seriously when you tell me why I'm wrong.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

@ phx

In a true debate, you would present arguments as to why MY arguments about death panels are false. You would also present a counter argument to my postulate that a death panel doesn't have to be named a "death panel" as such so as to not make it a defacto death panel. You know...the rose is a rose is a rose postulate.

Explain why, in your opinion why the words death panel are incorrect and exactly how the operation of the various rationing and efficiency panels appointed by the government are different in OUTCOME from the definition of death panel as known in the popular vernacular.

Just doing a "nanny nanny boo boo you are so dumb argument" without any supporting arguments or references is just a lazy and losing way to debate. I think you are better than this.

In the words of our previous pedantic hostess. Try harder

:=D

test said...

phx said...
Fuck you. Go persuade some high schoolers of that nonsense. I've earned my place here far more than you have ever done.


"Earned"? What does being an asshole earn you?

You're a lightweight.

That really hurts from someone so completely incapable of arguing policy they substitute things like "This is why we can't have nice things".

sakredkow said...

Just ignore me, Marshal. You've never had anything to say here that I was interested in. It's not hard for me to ignore you.

Icepick said...

Just ignore me, Marshal. You've never had anything to say here that I was interested in. It's not hard for me to ignore you.

Except that, apparently, you won't.

sakredkow said...

In a true debate, you would present arguments...

My argument has been nothing more than the merits or demerits of characterizing IPABs as death panels. IMO people who are still selling that canard hurt the GOP and hurt the ability of others who actually might have good arguments against ACA.

I don't think I've ever argued the ACA here. Maybe, I don't recall.

sakredkow said...

If you don't want to argue about whether or not people should call the IPABs death panels you can just ignore me. I ignore others who are making arguments that I don't want to dispute.

Then you have people like Marshal who just troll with irrelevancies so he get into a childish namecalling festival.

sakredkow said...

@Icepick you know I don't ever address Marshal? The only time I speak to him is when he addresses me.

It's like the two of you are needy for my attention.

test said...

phx said...
Just ignore me, Marshal. You've never had anything to say here that I was interested in.


Not surprising given your only purpose is attacking. Never engage an idea, just throw out one stupid snark after another. No doubt this is what passes for intelligence amongst your crowd, so it's no wonder you're confused.

sakredkow said...

Not surprising given your only purpose is attacking.

Pretty clear you aren't up to defending against my attacks. You just want to make it all personal and do your namecalling thing.

Why not ignore me, Marshal? I promise I'll NEVER notice you if you don't notice me.

sakredkow said...

{It's not like he's one of the smarter conservatives here.}

virgil xenophon said...

phx/

Are you really brain-dead--or are you just trying real hard to make us think you are? Do you even read? Ever hear the term "functional equivalent?" Well, IPAB="functional equivalent" of "death panels." Read the damn law, moron. Look, there are many things about which one may honorably disagree, e.g., our Syrian policy (or lack thereof) but how anyone who is a) literate and/or b) has had even a nodding acquaintance with government bureaucracies--whether academic or experiential--can pretend that there are no functional equivalents of "death panels" in the AHCA (the details of which many here have already outlined and/or quoted directly from the act) takes an act of willful blindness and malevolent disingenuous..

test said...

phx said...
Why not ignore me, Marshal?


You're ruining the board with your idiocy. Why don't you find a board where being an asshole to non-leftists is appreciated? It's not like that doesn't describe 98% of leftist political sites. Is that what you meant by "earned"? Being an asshole here gets you bonus points with your leftist homies?

Aridog said...

Just re-read all the comments on this thread. It reminds me of those semantic gibberish topics on TOP. Phx, you especially, seemed to go off the deep end on the issue of terminology as being more important than actual effects, as if a term is a cause of anything. Others defended a term as if it was sacrosanct, only one IIRC seemed to give it the levity semantic nonsense deserves [Bags].

I cited a specific example of how Obamacare is increasing certain care reductions....due in part to Obamacare's reductions in Medicare funding to fund other aspects of the law. And **crickets**.

I think Bagoh20's "CCCP" is a perfect term for the reality of Obamacare. I don't think many people really grasp just how government bureaucracy works to expand its reach and deny benefits in the process....in turn funding increasing federal staff and crony business hand outs.

But, as you age, you ARE going to learn.

Anonymous said...

Phx.

They want an echo chamber. Get it?

Dust Bunny Queen said...

They want an echo chamber. Get it?

Do YOU have something to contribute to the conversation and the issue of whether a Death Panel needs to be actually named as such or whether the equivalent effect of a panel like the IPAB give us the results of a death panel.

I have asked pbx to expound on why he/she thinks that there is no such thing or no such effect.

crickets

YOU are also invited to contribute something intelligent....if you can.

Persuade us. Try harder ;-P

Aridog said...

Oh, goodie...I've always wanted to be part of "they", now I am. How'bout that!

Trooper York said...

Lets refocus. Phx do you think that medical care will be rationed as a function of Obamacare with the government making the decisions about care instead of the doctors? Much as they do in Britain and other places that have socialized medicine.

Trooper York said...

Do you think it is better than the insurance companies governed by the marketplace making these decisions with the government stepping in only the most egregious cases? Or do you want all government control all the time as most Democrats desire?

test said...

fionamcgee said...
Phx.

They want an echo chamber. Get it?


It's amazing lefties convince themselves the only choices are their assholishness or "echo chambers". No doubt tomorrow they'll be lecturing others about nuance.

Making sense: not a lefty concern.

Aridog said...

Trooper York asked ...

... do you think that medical care will be rationed as a function of Obamacare ...?

Yes, it will...it has to be rationed, if only to make up for the take away from Medicare the PPACA entails. Turn 65 and enjoy MF'rs.

I gave a simple example earlier on this thread. It will also apply to more serious matters. I am very glad my case went before the "Cancer Board" of a major hospital in 2012. By 2013 I doubt I'd have been allocated treatment. Treatment that was successful as of my last check up 21 August 2013, by the way.

Aridog said...

Let me say it another way: You have no business trying to determine how many turns of the vise screw should be made until your own nuts are in that same vise. THEN it has meaning...the rest is bureaucratic rhetorical bullshit.

Aridog said...

How comfortable are you with answering the questions on this Medicare required Wellness questionnaire? There are several versions, but you WILL be required to answer these questions on one form or another if you are 65+ years of age.

I'm not saying it is good or bad. What do you think about it? Do you detect a "pattern" in the question series? What is it?

Amartel said...

The people from the echo chamber are talking again. Echoing, projecting, deflecting, genuflecting to their greedy god. Full of sound and fury and adding nothing of interest or substance to the discussion. Ever.

This is no echo chamber, not that i'd want one anyway. Many very different points of view in here. I'd love to hear from a lefty with a brain. It's pretty much what was interesting about TOP. Prog values are hitting the reality wall. Interesting to see what stays and what gets jettisoned. And who just keeps plowing Forward.