Humbled by the love with which you have treated each of our posters and me. Thanking us for what we are trying to do; to provide a place where we can comment on whatever we want. I'm reluctantly, but resolutely asking one thing.
Some of you, a very small number of you, are still bashing Althouse. We are asking you to please stop. We like Althouse, we have always liked Althouse and that is not going to change.
We need to move on.
We are going to be respectfully linking to her, as we link to other bloggers. Naturally, we are probably going to be linking to her more often than other bloggers.
The comments of those posts that link to her, should not be taken as opportunity to bash her. If you feel you still have something to say to her, email her. But please don't continue to bash her here.
Thanks for your emailed posts ideas and for your continued support.
Level42 - Lessons In Love
It took me a long while to "write" that up there.
Lets say you were Althouse, how would you correct that "writing" up there?
Please don't deviate from the main point. The main point being, please stop bashing Althouse.
Of course, you don't have to help me with the writing, if you don't want to.
399 comments:
1 – 200 of 399 Newer› Newest»From a post on Althouse a little while ago...
What on earth is going on here? Was Drive a fluke, or is [Nicolas Winding] Refn just another no-talent from the Lars von Trier school of Something Rotten in Denmark flummery?
I love Lars.
Perfect as is.
People felt quite hurt. I know I did. And something very fine was lost.
But I agree with you; time to move on.
Bygones, not bitterness.
I can't stop loving you
With all due respect, and Lem, I respect you immensely, I think this is unsustainable policy. There will be more sensitive issues in the future than Althouse, and how will you justify not taking the same approach with them, or will you? She is just a blogger, a public person. I'm very fond of my dog, but I let people call her a bitch, and she even supports flea speech.
That said, it will always be your house - your rules. I'll follow them.
I wish I knew how to quit you!
Thank you pogo.
Your place, your rules.
And I hope all you ever have to do is ask.
Thank you bags... and thank everybody that agree and I wont be directly thanking because we have lives outside the blogs. I know batamax would probably disagree with that.
Perhaps what we need for this site to succeed is a focus. I have found the guest hosts to date
(Pastafarian, Lem, Deborah, Paddy O, Freeman Hunt, Palladian, Chip Ahoy) very interesting. It occurred to me that many of our commenters have "stories to tell":
what it's like to run a small business
the joys and sorrows of rescue dogs
home schooling trials and tribulations
living in an integrated community
blue collar jobs, pros and cons
etc., etc., etc,
One of my favourite books is:
Working: People Talk About What They Do All Day and How They Feel About What They Do by Studs Terkel
Perhaps Studs Terkel's best-known book, Working is a compelling look at jobs and the people who do them. Consisting of over one hundred interviews with everyone from a gravedigger to a studio head, from a policeman to a piano tuner, this book provides an enduring portrait of people's feelings about their working lives.
A deep penetration of American thought and feeling . . . A celebration of individuals . . . A masterpiece. -- Los Angeles Times
Splendid . . . Important . . . Rich and fascinating . . . The people we meet are not digits in a poll but real people with real names who share their anecdotes, adventures, and aspirations with us. -- Business Week
The real American experience . . . The poetry of real people . . . The hardness of real lives . . . A grand subject and a splendid book. -- Chicago Daily News
[Studs Turkel records the voices of America. Men and women from every walk of life talk to him, telling him of their likes and dislikes, fears, problems, and happinesses on the job. Once again, Turkel has created a rich and unique document that is as simple as conversation, but as subtle and heartfelt as the meaning of our lives....
Perhaps we can learn from each other what our lives are like, the diversity and commonality. Posts would be respected, not ridiculed. Good discussion could follow.
Good idea, Ah Pooh.
But we could also use an Emmanuel Goldstein.
I understand Bush isn't very busy right now.
Lets blame him.
But Dad, Meade started it, and even though you said never to do it, he punched me in the stomach when you were at work.
There will be more sensitive issues in the future than Althouse, and how will you justify not taking the same approach with them, or will you?
We discuss them and we move on. Even Obama is term limited.
My sisters always used that one against me and my brother.
That Meade has a long reach don't he?
"Even Obama is term limited."
Well, to be fair, it's the only law he hasn't broken yet, because he hasn't needed to yet. I'm expecting we might have burn down the White House to get him out.
On the bright side since I stopped posting at Althouse, if you link to an Althouse post I cannot offer an opinion.
Hey, that's my new "policy."
The crowd cheers !!!
Plus to continue bashing Althouse would be redundant and piling on.
Everything I've said here the past couple days, I've mentioned at Althouse previously. Shocking!
Again, nothing new under the sun when it comes to political blogging except new bloggers.
Good Luck Lem!
Lem, from day one, you have been a class act.
I am so glad I found this place.
But now, what do we call you guys?
Magnificent Seven is taken.
It seemed clear that Althouse felt unappreciated, and even ignored, by her commenters. People would rush past her carefully written posts to get to the comments. This wasn't the only reason, or even the main reason, she shut them down, I think. (cough-Mary-cough-cough.) But had she not felt so ignored, I think she would have continued to put up with the disruptions of Mary and the insults from a few regular commenters.
And when Althouse abruptly shut down comments, commenters felt as though Althouse hadn't appreciated them. And those commenters' feelings were justified, in my opinion.
But with very few exceptions, I think everyone here holds Althouse in very high esteem. She's respected, admired, and loved. If she wasn't, we wouldn't have read her for all of these years. And having read her, you can't help but admire her. Even some of the more curmudgeonly among us, who aren't able or willing to admit it, find admirable qualities in Althouse.
You know those group hugs we engaged in, during the first few days of grieving? I think we need to send one of those over to Althouse.
How was it done again?((((o))))
That's not it. That looks more like a puckered asshole than it does a hug.
What the hell happened on the other thread? I agree that Althouse bashing here gives her a reason to say, 'see, that is why'. But there is no reason to kowtow to her here.
{{{{{}}}}
A better approach I would think, rather than not being mean to Althouse, is for folks to stop thinking of her as the center of the universe, for good or for ill. No one's blog life should be defined by her existence or what she says or does not say or how she says it.
Indeed, just out of curiosity, I have taken a look over there and saw that she opened up comments quite a few times today and -- and this is really the point here -- there were quite a few people here dutifully over there despite the fact that she still thinks you are "losers." Certainly, if she has retracted that, or apologized for it, I've not seen it. But hey, to each his own. Some people are honored to have someone who craps on them condescend to allow her to crap on them.
In any event, really now, Althouse is not the center of the universe, she's not the be all and end all. There is a blog life without having to piggy back on her or otherwise commenting about her, either to compliment or criticize. Time to let it go and give her egotistical narcissism a rest.
I don't have anything more to say about it anyway. I think we're done. Arriving at that point now, I do hope she is not hurt, but I must admit that I would be, but I'm a pussy. I always assumed she was tougher than me. She's a lawyer after all, and as long as they keep swimming forward they're fine.
The comments of those posts that link to her, should not be taken as opportunity to bash her.
Anything wrong with that sentence?
I for one endorse not being shat upon.
I will mention though that harrogate has stated his distaste for not being called a libtard.
So, group hug, but with a simultaneous noogie for the libtard. I say that with love.
Bash me all you want. No really - feel free. I won't defend myself. Enjoy.
But I appreciate what Lem wrote very much (and he wrote it so well): Don't bash Althouse. Lem loves her, I love her, and one or two other people do too.
If you feel you need to bash her, start your own blog. Make it a hate Althouse site if that is what you're into. You'll have plenty of company and even some competition.
But don't bash her here, because Lem is no loser and he clearly doesn't care to have losers acting like losers on his site. Lem is a man. I see a few others here are too. If you aren't, well, you're not dead yet. There is still time to man up, stop acting like a loser, and prove Althouse wrong.
Yeah, Bender, I remember the losers, beta males, insects, let-me-taste-your-tears insults too.
I've concluded that she was trying to drive a wedge, to create a blow-up. She goaded people into saying shitty things back.
I'm not sure if she did this consciously, or if her subconscious mind led her to do this to justify what she really wanted to do for several months, shut down and limit comments, because she felt ignored.
Yeah, I remember the insults. They seemed a little nuts at the time, and I worried about her.
I'm going to turn the other cheek. That's just how I roll, I'm a great guy. I'm basically like Jesus.
You're right, she's not the center of the universe. But she is a common interest that we all hold, or held at one time.
So let me get this straight.
Althouse has closed her comment section to all but the selected toadys, lickspittles and teachers pets while bashing her commenters in every other post. In the meantime Meade comes over here to stir the shit and try to cause problems on every post he comments on while also trying to grift the last dime he can get while spitting in your eye.
You answer is not to bash them back.
Fair enough. As many people have said this is your place so it is your rules. I don't know what you are going to do when Meade comes around to start shit but that is of course up to you.
I hope it works out for you. I don't see how it can but I wish you luck.
Your co-bloggers share a lot of talent with you and if you focus on other topics it could work out just fine.
Good luck.
I am good with your policy. If I need to tease Meade or Ann (and yes I am especially pissed off with Meade and his recent pot stirring) I can do it at my blog. Or Troop's. Or Crack's.
But my only advice is go your own way (blog the way you want).
But I share Troop's sentiments about this whole debacle. And I know who started it all.
Oh and by the way while I was writing this comment Meade came by to prove my point.
I guess you decided on the direction of your blog. It is a one way street.
Or is it?
Hey, Meade, I'm not alone in this: I respect, admire, and love you too. You were one of the wittiest commenters here in what were the early days for me.
However: You've been a bit of a dick lately.
Even your last comment -- you had to get that little dig in: Losers acting like losers, man up. Gahhh.
The irony here is: You of all people, dude. We remember the great LGM deletion, when the liberal blog that you frequented as a commenter deleted hundreds of your comments, and you were pissed.
You of all people should appreciate the way these commenters felt when Althouse abruptly blew up the community they'd formed.
Instapundit just emailed me to say: Man up, indeed.
Funny, he just emailed me to say "heh".
Let's talk frankly, Meade -- because I'm a simple person and I'm not good at levels of meaning.
What was the purpose of the dig, and of the comments you've left where you're picking at the scabs and just trying to get people pissed off again?
Again, Meade's on a suicide mission. When your opposition is imploding, get the hell out of the way!
One could write a book re: Meade's inconsistencies. But Althouse would delete it! :-P
I will abide by your wishes out of respect for you and the other contributors to the blog, Lem.
However--
1. Some people have lost all respect and affection for Althouse. I think those who fit into that camp have every right to their feelings, and I would submit that the proper way for them to handle that is to simply ignore links and discussions that involve Althouse. There are plenty of other things to discuss. These folks should have their wishes respected and not be guilted or nudged into a congeniality that they do not feel.
2. I respectfully request that the expectation of respectful behavior that you are expressing here apply to all commenters. For example, if Lemlings refrain from taking potshots at Althouse, her husband needs to refrain from taking potshots at Lemlings.
3. Thank you Lem and all the other contributors and commenters who are working to build this enjoyable community.
It looks like this will be similar to the U.S. following the Geneva convention fighting terrorists. Still, that's the rules of engagement ordered. Take it, and hold your fire men.
I notice that almost none of the old commenters showed up for her moderated cafe.
Lem's a good egg.
Ken, maybe that is precisely what Meade is trying to accomplish with his baiting.
Meade, I don't want to bash you; I want to ignore you. Except when you come here and act like a jerk. Then I want to say, Please stop acting like a jerk because you're stinking up the joint.
That doesn't seem too complicated to me.
I told you he punched in me stomach. Do you believe me now?
These folks should have their wishes respected and not be guilted or nudged into a congeniality that they do not feel.
Nice flare.
Pastafarian said...
"Let's talk frankly, Meade -- because I'm a simple person and I'm not good at levels of meaning.
What was the purpose of the dig, and of the comments you've left where you're picking at the scabs and just trying to get people pissed off again?"
My purpose was to help you re-form "the community [you]'d formed" at Althouse. And to slap some of you out of it.
Thanks Freeman.
Lem, what do you mean by 'nice flare?'
I'm not as clever as most of you. I'm just saying plainly what I am thinking.
I am just an observer of this whole situation. I am appalled at the classless behavior of both Ann there and Meade here. Wow, just wow. Meade, please get lost.
I wasn't aware of it, but then I left long before the latest scuffle (when she was turning the most benign remark into a racist "dog whistle").
I like Althouse, and have defended her over at LegalInsurrection, but I think she forgot that her commenters were half the reason people came to visit her.
BTW Meade, since you seem to be itching to throw feces over here:
1) Do you and Althouse recognize that you did something wrong?
2) Do you intend to apologize to the people you injured?
"Lem's a good egg."
Wait, those sink to the bottom don't they?
As I said, Meade, I'm a simple man. You need to be less symbolic and more direct, or I will not understand what you're saying.
Al Swearingen slapped the newspaper editor to get him to print an article impugning one of Swearingen's rivals, if I recall correctly. To further Swearingen's ambitions.
So you've lost me here. You're Al Swearingen, and you want us to...?
And how does stirring up shit help us reform the community?
Lem's a good egg
Sure he's a good egg. But now with this smarmy POS coming in the last few minutes (11:39) and presuming to tell people how to act here, Lem is in an untenable position. He can either be his own "man" and tell him and AA to fuck off and not come in here as if they own the place, or he can be their bitch and do what they told him to do and not allow people to bash Althouse. Lem does them a solid, and this is the thanks he gets.
"1) Do you and Althouse recognize that you did something wrong?
2) Do you intend to apologize to the people you injured?"
Lay it on me, Fen. Make your case. Show me your damages and show how they were caused by us.
That was a good sentence. There was Nothing behind it other than a compliment.
Bagoh, my brother used to pull that shit all the time.
On Psychiatry rounds in med school, we were taught to beware of the patient who took more than a few minutes of discussion, whose behavior instead dominated rounds.
Trooper is describing classic "splitting", for example. Lem and Bender's differing views confirm it.
I'm done with it.
And feel stupid for not having seen it, old as I am.
I would like to hear what Paddy, Freeman and Palladian have to say about this if it is ok with them.
Meade: "Lay it on me, Fen. Make your case. Show me your damages and show how they were caused by us."
You are not aware that Althouse trolled her own comment thread? Mocking people who were making a good faith rebuttal re how men have no reproductive rights?
Lem, thank you for clarifying. I would be dismayed if you thought I was insulting or disrespecting you and wanted to make sure that was not the case.
Carry on.
"And how does stirring up shit help us reform the community?"
I'm a simple man too, Pasta. Tell me what you mean by "stirring up shit" and show me the examples of where I did it. I think you'll find it was others who were doing the stirring and, if anything, I counter-stirred. So condemn me.
Those are my own thoughts and my thoughts are my own.
"You are not aware that Althouse trolled her own comment thread? Mocking people who were making a good faith rebuttal re how men have no reproductive rights?"
No, I'm not. Bring your evidence.
"1) Do you and Althouse recognize that you did something wrong?"
So apparently the answer is "no"
I would suggest that Bagoh be placed in charge of enforcing the new policy if only he could rain clothed and sober.
And Meade, why are you so angry?
You're actually trolling people who like you and Althouse.
Damages?
Suppose I own a stand of trees. (That's her blog. Again, I'm a simpleton, I'm spelling it out for my own benefit, to keep it all straight.)
In that stand of trees, a great flock of some rare and wonderful bird nests.
Some of the birds shit on my car. Others fuck on my patio. This disturbs me.
Am I justified in burning down my stand of trees?
Morally, in my opinion, no fucking way. It's a rare bird. It's wasteful, destructive, and petulant. Even legally, I suspect some federal agency would be two feet up your ass if you did that.
It's a rare bird, the quality of commenter that you had at that site.
Meade knows Althouse will be closing up shop soon so he's looking for a new place to nest er troll.
If he went to a blog where nobody knew him, he would be totally ignored. It's that basic.
Here's one recount of the episode:
"Ann Althouse pretty much had an online meltdown of epic proportions just a few days ago that resulted in her closing down comments in an act of desperate cowardice.
She basically started a debate on how men are at fault for everything when the family courts hammer them flat in divorce or custody hearings. Even when the woman in question picked a used condom out of the garbage and used the contents to self-impregnate and thereby force the man to cough up child support. According to Althouse it’s still his fault.
Evidently it’s all a primacy of the uterus so to speak.
Well she caught a huge amount of flack for that and couldn’t stand the heat. And quite frankly her counter-arguments were juvenile at best and hardly worth reading. Having those uterus blinders on is evidently a major obstacle"
[...]
Meade, What parts do you not understand?
and another:
"it stemmed from Instapundit calling her out, then she proceeding to browbeat her readers into agreeing with her."
I notice that Insty is no longer linking to her, and I respect his judgement - so Althouse must have crosse a line somewhere, Meade.
and my own remarks:
I’m going to miss the old Althouse. She had a unique thing going on: a liberal blogger who actually believed in free speech (sorry Jeralyn) and intelligent commenters on both the right AND the left. Althouse would toss the Jump Ball and we would fight over it. Debates were very heated but also very interesting and educational, esp the opposing teams POV.
There was always a troll problem, almost always from the Left. I think the Moonbat community couldn’t stand that Althouse was providinig a venue where Right vs Left could debate the latest “cause” with civility. Take away the Left’s sophomoronic slogans and demonization and they have little left to work with. She also pissed off “feminists” like Marcotte and Valenti because she wouldn’t bend over for Clinton and whitewash his sexual predation in the workplace.
I think somewhere along the way Hubris got to her. She forgot (or took for granted) that 1/2 of her success was the back and forth in her commentary. I left long ago because I was weary of her racism (no equal protection, only blacks were protected form of racial slurs) and she dug deeper by hearing “dog whistles” everywhere. I am surprised by what I’ve read about the recent Althouse, read the thread where she baited and insulted men who trusted her good faith rhetoric. Not the Althouse I knew. Too bad.
"Please Stop"
Agreed. But I would also add: please stop, Meade.
"And Meade, why are you so angry?
You're actually trolling people who like you and Althouse."
I'm angry? News to me.
If I were a troll, my goal would be to weaken this blog, damage, and destroy it. I want just the opposite. I want Lem's blog to endure and to be interesting.
"...if only he could rain clothed and sober.
Well then I need weekends off, and weekends start on hump day.
This seems to end the peace treaty negotiations based on the 1967 borders.
"...show me the examples..."
I already did, in my first comment directed to you, at 11:49.
You want me to go back through previous threads, so I can copy and paste and quote you verbatim? Jesus, Meade. I know you married a lawyer, but I didn't know that sort of crap was contagious.
As I said, you've always been a very clever commenter. Some of your digs have been subtle. Interjecting, out of the blue, something like:
'Hey, you ungrateful bastards, be sure to hit the tip jar for poor Lem here, don't leave him hanging like you did Althouse, you cheap bastards.'
That's a paraphrase, not a quote. You would have said it in a much more subtle way, to give yourself deniability. But even an idiot like me could see through what you were doing.
Did I guess your real purpose at 11:56, Meade?
Grifters gotta grift Pasta.
The take must be down so they need to round up some rubes.
Meade: "I'm angry?"
Yup. You come across as a petulant little girl. Maybe your tone isn't translating.
"If I were a troll,..."
You would continue to dodge questions asked in good faith. I'll pitch them to you again:
1) Do you and Althouse recognize that you did something wrong?
2) Do you intend to apologize to the people you injured?
and a 3rd: if Althouse is blameless, why has Instapundit stopped linking to her? He use to link to Ann almost once a day.
MH. true that.
I need weekends off
Sorry, the.job has been filled. They are bringing in Garage Mahal for the job.
Lem tried to make peace. To lead and be the better man, but it was crapped on.
Some people just don't know how to "man up and stop being a loser."
People are feeling the loss of Helen Thomas in ways I never expected.
Lem, the effort to keep your blog a safe haven and a place where even new commenters feel at home are right in line with your character: upright, humble, honest, and admirable.
It's a shame when someone takes your good intentions shown in this post and uses it to inflame old wounds, and inflict new damage...(NOT COOL!!)
It's strange, but people often become what they have professed to hate.
And now, I fully intend to abide by your wishes.....I will ignore any trolling, and yet hope it stops.
Or is it Treyvon Martin? I dunno; I get confused. There seems to be a need bash.
Where is garage?
I thought we were friends.
I contradicted him a number of times but we never got personal.
except one time he called me punk but I think he meant it in jest.
MH is on roll.
I repeat that it would be interesting to hear what the co-bloggers have to say. I think I get what Lem and Pasta are saying but it would be helpful for the others to weigh in.
Especially Palladian.
Let's face it he has a lot of weight to throw around. Just sayn'
Meade, if you're taking this amount of time to respond because you're trying to find the clip of Swearingen's man gouging out that big guy's eyeball in the mud, don't bother.
Re Lem: "...right in line with your character: upright, humble, honest, and admirable."
Echo that.
@ Lem: You ever want me to back off, just let me know. I won't give you any lip. My word as a Marine.
Garage was dedicated.
If you guys hear from him or know where he hangs out tell him he is welcomed here.
I'm tempted to find a clip of Wu. He had several lines, mostly all the same two words, that would work nicely here as a rebuttal to your comments, Meade.
Oh! oh! let me be the one to invite him over! :)
Lem he is at the Green Bay Packers training camp trying to steal Aaron Rodger jockstrap and munching on roadkill. Don't worry he will be along soon.
Lem tried to make peace. To lead and be the better man, but it was crapped on.
Some people just don't know how to "man up and stop being a loser."
Exactly. Some people are apparently unaware of the big frigging beam that's sticking out of their eyeball.
"Did I guess your real purpose at 11:56, Meade?"
No. In fact you got it exactly wrong. By the way, the experiment in moderated comments was a success. Beginning tomorrow, comments will be permanently off. It simply isn't worth it. She's a writer and a blogger. The early days of commenting brought some worthwhile feedback but the last several years have devolved into a sort of twitter site/chat room within a blog. I don't expect anyone else to appreciate the time and attention that drew away from what she wants to do which is write the best blog she can. She doesn't want to be an editor of other people's comments and neither do I. Anyone who truly appreciates her blogging - and I see more and more clearly that that is a limited and select set of readers - does not want to see her time and efforts compromised.
We have encouraged Lem and some of his contributors in getting this blog up and running. My hope is that the same individuals whose behavior led to Ann shutting down her comments are not able to do the same to Lem's.
Good to see you here Fen. I admired the clarity in your writing. Nobody can ever say they didn't know where you were coming from on an issue.
Anyhow, Lem offered up a nice pot of chili then someone peed in it and we all lost our appetites.
With that, sleep well, good night.
And join us tomorrow for another episode of As The Comments Turn.
Nice to see you too Yashu.
Hey, cut Meade some slack as it does take him a little longer when he "tries" to be witty.
Humor can be a difficult concept ...
Not to worry Meade, when Althouse disappears Lem will welcome you w/open arms.
Give me your tired, your poor ~ Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.
So Meade, no response re:
3) if Ann is blameless, how come Instapundit no longer links to her?
Thanks Lem. I "cut my teeth" so to speak during my years at Althouse. Really improved my research skills, my counter-troll flaming, and my understanding of issues outside my own echo-chamber.
Here's hoping you guys can recreate that experience here.
My thoughts:
Proverbs 25:21-22
If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat; if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. If he has an open thread, give him comments.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head, and the Lord will reward you.
(part of that may not be in the original).
I've said my thoughts in other places hereabouts, which seems confirmed. Althouse was feeling parched, comments were making the blogging less fun, she has a streak to maintain.
Curiously, Althouse created the atmosphere that led to that. Again and again, there were requests to be less welcoming to the clear bad faith commenters. Often she was amused by them herself, by the drama, the comment links.
It's her place, so she got tired of the world she fostered and wants to go back to the purity. I get that. I purposely let my own blog stagnate, I don't solicit links, I sketch out thoughts for myself. I enjoy writing and I suspect Althouse does too.
She's needing to express her own voice again. I respect that.
Breaking up is hard, though, and for some people the only way they can do it is through anger or blame. It's justifying the change, even when there's no need.
Althouse was a great forum because she offered an intelligent and varied discussion, which was especially popular because of politics but kept a variety of interests engaged. Good stuff for the 9 years I visited is noteworthy.
She fostered a unique forum and I think very much welcomed the commenting. Sheesh, she even married a commenter. That says a lot. She valued the conversation even as she often asserted her contentedness with her independence.
So now? She's moved on. Breaking up hurts, but I don't take it personally. I guess that's why I don't feel angry. I think it would have been more mature to just be forthright about needing a change, about being open about her emotions. But, we aren't owed that.
It's her, not me. There's other bloggers in the sea.
So, I just don't have any passion in me about it at all. I probably should spend less time in comments and blogs myself, but I really do learn from you all in a lot of ways, and this is a great forum to sketch out thoughts, give a space for an occasional jokes. Althouse hosted a community that fit my style, but now the community is here.
Althouse is a very smart, very insightful, very-well rounded woman. I appreciated her approach to religion, an interested but not committed approach.
She offered a lot, but at the end of the day her specialty was Constitutional law, and there are other places for that. Her other posts came out of her personal interests or adventures, and we have people hereabout who have interests and adventures.
I guess I'm fine with an amiable breakup, and if she feels a need to blame and accuse to be free, then I'll take it, because she's offered a lot over the years. That's what a man does sometimes, just absorbs it and moves on.
I have no idea what I just wrote. But those are the thoughts that happened to highlight themselves so there you go.
Night MH.
Fen said...
So Meade, no response re:
3) if Ann is blameless, how come Instapundit no longer links to her?
Fen, Instapundit has been linking to her. So your premise is wrong.
Ah, forgot to mention.... I sent a message to Fr. Martin Fox expressing hope that he'd drop in when his schedule and work allows.
The experiment was a success, but they'll be off? Um, OK. Whatevs.
I still don't get how coming in here and calling us losers, and that we need to "man up", is going to help this blog, Meade.
Maybe you weren't directing it at everyone. But consider the specific insults you used -- they're meant to evoke memories of Althouse's insults that she rained down upon every single conservative commenter. Of course we'll all interpret your insult as being directed at all of us.
And even if your jab had been received only by the intended targets -- let's take a concrete example. Sixty Grit. He's pretty anti-Althousian at the moment. Let's say you only meant to insult him, and only he felt this as an insult. How does insulting him prevent him from dragging this blog down, as you think he dragged the other blog down?
That was a very Protestant response Paddy. Thank you. I am impressed.
Enjoy going to church tomorrow. You know the Gospel is the story of Martha and Mary:
As Jesus and his disciples were on their way, He entered a village and a woman called Martha welcomed him to her house. She had a sister named Mary who sat down at the Lord's feet to listen to his words. Martha, meanwhile, was busy with all the serving and finally she said, «Lord, don't you care that my sister has left me to do all the serving?». But the Lord answered, «Martha, Martha, you worry and are troubled about many things, whereas only one thing is needed. Mary has chosen the better part, and it will not be taken away from her.
Thanks for contacting him Michael H.
I always appreciated his comments.
I didn't read all the comment threads at Althouse. Apparently, I missed a lot. Some people really sound angry and bitter.....How the world ever escaped a nuclear conflagration I will never know. The most attenuated of human relationships are the ones we form here. It is impossible to harm one another. We're a community of saints. We live in an empyrean realm like the angels in heaven. Sadly, we're sublunar creatures with an infinite desire to hurt each other, and living this unearthly existence drives us to paroxysms of impotent rage. A certain amount of emasculation is needed to survive in heaven.
To paraphrase Paddy: let it go, keep moving into the future, and do the best work you can do in whatever you do.
I wish you all well and I wish Lem's blog great success.
Fr. Martin Fox ...
I' forgotten about him. I guess I'll apologies if he comes by.
btw where is Inga. did she have a fight here too?
Meade, Insty is the first site I log onto every morning. I don't recall seeing him link to Ann since her meltdown. Perhaps you can provide some examples.
BTW, someone mention downpage that Ann & I dated. Thats not true, never met her in person.
There was this one time where I offered to pick her up from the airport in DC and drive her to her hotel, as a courtesy. But I cancelled the day prior. I told her my day was full of meetings, but the truth was: my car was filthy dirty, I didn't have time to get it cleaned, and I was too embarassed to have a VIP like Ann ride in it.
"Maybe you weren't directing it at everyone."
I wasn't. Neither was she. I'm glad you get that.
Good night.
Pogo, as I understand it splitting is a tactic largely used by borderline personalities. These are people who have severe boundary issues (unable to respect where they end and others begin, asking and expecting too much of others, etc.) and have extreme lack-of-trust issues. These symptoms have been brought about by extremely poor parenting such that the kid can't form trust. A splitter on a psych ward is a patient that attempts to play members of the staff against each other in order to get what they want, and the staff must be on guard not to be split.
Meade may be acting like a spoiled three year-old who's been deprived of his favorite toy, but I don't think he's splitting. He's acting out.
Now, if Althouse is Nurse A and Lem is Nurse B, who can we identify as splitters?
To add, I also understand Meade's position. Of course he takes her side. He's privy to a lot of understanding no one else is, and more than that, he's her husband. He's doing what he should, they're a team and he's playing the right role. She's stepping back into her writing and he's creating a fence so she can do that.
He's managing her landscape. He's great at that and I pray they find more and more happiness together in their lives as they seek peace. I genuinely wish them the best. And I guess I'm confident enough in my own ideas and contributions that I don't take the slights personally. I don't see them directed at me. I might be deluding myself but it's happy in the delusion.
Thank you Meade.
Okay, I'm drowsy but not asleep yet.
I just had a vision of Mr Miagi teaching a blog-fu lesson.
Comments on. Comments off. Comments on. Comments off.
I think there was a huge misunderstanding, and, perhaps, some willful failure to understand one another on both sides, but I think the continual comments about Althouse have crossed a line into cruelty at times. As for Meade, his wife has been continually run down, so I wouldn't expect anything other than what I've seen. There always a few who relish a conflict and so try to heap up grudges and sow hatred; I have no respect for that. You'll be annoyed about something, and they'll tell you you should be pissed; you're pissed, they tell you you should be furious; you're furious, they tell you you should be frozen with hate. Nonsense.
Althouse and Meade are two people in this whole wide world. If you like what Althouse has to say, and I for one do, read her. If not, don't. I think it's excellent that Lem's made a place where we can all keep commenting. It was never intended to be the blog of The Latest Althouse Outrage. This blog is it's own thing. I like it. I'm glad everybody's here.
Lem, you are one clever dude. A talented layer of traps.
Fair enough Paddy, but he could do all that without showing up over here picking at scabs. It's not pleasant for anyone and is definitely not necessary.
I might make a cheesecake tomorrow. I'm supposed to be going low-carb but I keep putting it off. I have a huge brick of cream cheese that I bought on a whim at Costco and it needs to be used up. If any of you is within a couple hours of San Antonio and wants a slice let me know.
Meade, that's a good summary, exactly how I feel.
Choose the better part indeed, Trooper.
I agree Freeman, I'm just late to the party and wanted to give Meade opportunity to state for the record that they are not blameless.
I agree Paddy.
It is time to close the book on this.
Lem, you are one clever dude. A talented layer of traps.
Put some meat on the bones bags.. what ya mean?
IHMMP- cheesecake is always a good decision. Always.
Meade: "...whose behavior led to Ann shutting down her comments are not able to do the same to Lem's."
That's an interesting sentence. Note that it lacks parallelism. You're normally a very precise writer, and I think the fucked-up structure of this sentence is instructive. You're giving the negative commenters too much credit. They didn't shut down comments, Althouse chose to. I'm sure their behavior was one factor.
I really doubt Sixty Grit is going to start insulting Lem, by the way. That's what would have to happen, for the same thing to happen here, right?
And the only thing that would make that happen is if someone came in from the outside and drove a wedge between Sixty Grit (and others like him) and Lem. Huh. Theory number two takes shape. Could be the gin typing, though.
It's late. I'm going to go vomit and pass out. Good night, Meade. Don't be a stranger. But don't be a dick, either.
I'm learning how to fight with a rapier.
And just started an MMA training program.
Tons of fun.
" A certain amount of emasculation is needed to survive in heaven."
You guys really have to work on that travel brochure. It needs to be more inviting if you want people to plan the trip.
Misplaced Pants (or is it I Have),
I get that, but people have different ways of responding and Meade has always been forthright and aggressive (which doesn't mean bad aggressive). He pursues. He pursued Althouse from the comments section. He seeks out the interactions.
And, honestly, it just shows me that they aren't letting this change happen lightly.
Hmmmmm. For Pogo and deborah, here's an additional piece to go with the info shared on splitting:
People matching the diagnostic criteria for narcissistic personality disorder also use splitting as a central defense mechanism. Most often the narcissist does this as an attempt to stabilize his/her sense of self positively in order to preserve his/her self-esteem, by perceiving himself/herself as purely upright or admirable and others who do not conform to his/her will or values as purely wicked or contemptible. Given "the narcissist's perverse sense of entitlement and splitting . .[s]he can be equally geared, psychologically and practically, towards the promotion and towards the demise of a certain collectively beneficial project." (Abdennur, the Narcissistic Principle of Equivalence).
IHMMP, you can make low carb cheesecake!
Althouse and Meade are two people in this whole wide world.
Where is my hill of beans?
Casablanca Lem?
Dude you have the wrong movie.
In a nutshell:
Althouse is a victim of her own success.
Whereas Meade ?!? ok, who the hell knows how Meade is part of the equation ...
Some things should not be made low-carb. Cheesecake is one of those things. (I'm not trying to tank your diet, IHMMP. I'm just starving and craving sugar. Sweet sweet carb-loaded sugar)
"Put some meat on the bones bags.. what ya mean?"
I think a wolf in sheep fleece was threatening the village and you flushed him out.
He couldn't help letting out a howl, and then everybody knew.
Maybe you're so clever, Lem didn't even know what you were up to. That's like meta-irony on hipster juice.
WTF, am I talking about?
Who am I? Why am I here?
Paddy,
Pants is fine, thanks (apologies to Homer Simpson for stealing his line),
Appreciate your thoughts. I just think that lecturing, presumptuousness, and aggressiveness--whether they are when you squint a natural human response to a particular situation or not--are not conducive to peace and good cheer, which is what I thought we were working on here.
As I said above, the answer is clear. People who don't like Meade or Althouse should find other things to talk about. Meade should mind his manners and accept that not everyone likes or respects him or his woman instead of arguing about it, and also refrain from insulting & mocking people which was one of the more unfortunate aspects of the Althouse comment section and one that I am happy has not been a problem here for the most part. People who like Althouse and Meade should coexist peacefully with those who don't. Everyone should let What Happened at Althouse fade into the past.
Freeman, maybe I will! Then I can eat the whole thing, right?!
Bagoh, I can't help but think of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Where_Do_We_Come_From%3F_What_Are_We%3F_Where_Are_We_Going%3F>Gauguin's</a> "Where Do We Come From? What Are We? Where Are We Going?".
And it's right down the street, why I can go look at it any time I like (after coughing up $17, of course).
Liked that Admiral Stockdale reference ah?
""Maybe you weren't directing it at everyone."
I wasn't. Neither was she. I'm glad you get that."
Of course this is true, but the execution was so careless, so without concern for the majority who were good faith-ers, and the refusal to apologize and make that clear distinction left all tarred. Only the person holding the brush can fix that, but they clearly are not up to it.
Aargh, messed up the hyperlink.
It's the extraordinarily long title of a Gauguin painting, in the Boston MFA.
IHMM-Pants, I heartily second what you just wrote, which you did with more clarity and succinctness than I could have.
MamaM, so good to see you here!
That's a very interesting quote. But I think we need to take care not to psychoanalyze (which, knowing you, you're not). I am using splitter colloquially, and I should have made that clear! The recent 'demise of a certain collectively beneficial project' was brought to an end by two factions, both of which were over-wrought.
Holy crap!
Fen, Revenant and !!!Father Fox!!! are down in the booze thread.
LMAO
Hey wait a minute. You are talking about fractions? What is this another math problem? Crap.
Basta, If I lived on Tahiti, I couldn't care less "Where Do We Come From? What Are We? Where Are We Going?"
Why aren't they just swimming, sexing and running the blender?
'Night all...talk tomorrow :)
"Fen, Revenant and !!!Father Fox!!! are down in the booze thread."
Dammit! I just washed the glasses. I'm not cleaning up any more puke around here.
Night Deb
Althouse was upset because people thought that men shouldn't be forced to be fathers? That's such a weak-tea disagreement, in my mind, that I would never believe it.
As for commenting and bashing...
Yes, people shouldn't bash. Just on general principles. There were a few people (that I generally ignored as hard as possible so I couldn't even name you names) who seemed to exist for no other purpose than to attack certain other people and it had gotten pretty bad. I honestly don't care what sort of fight someone got into with Inga, for example, but the holding of grudges was epic, juvenile and repulsive. By all means, have a heated argument while you argue. But if you're existing for no other reason than to abuse the person if they pop their head up again, something is wrong with you... not with the target of your ire. Just. Get. Over. It.
Either ignore someone or counter their arguments. Why spend all that energy to have a favored enemy?
It bothered me when someone would show up (drive by!) at Althouse to leave a pithy, "And you! A law professor!" attempt at shaming. It bothered me a lot when someone would, yet again, attack Althouse for voting for Obama... not just "Are you sorry yet?" but personal attacks. And the continued piling on of Inga... and I don't care if she "deserved" it or not... was extremely unpleasant and no one should be proud of himself for fighting that particular fight.
There are some things that are simply bad manners and ought never be done... following someone around the internet and attacking them for comments made elsewhere is lame... posting personal information *ever* or posting addresses. Good people don't do that...
"Bashing" to me is when someone brings up the past or attacks someone for the past or for something separate from the discussion at hand. Disagree, by all means. I prefer a place where someone is welcome to write "that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard" or even "you're a moron" as part of an argument. (I agree with Althouse about the "bull shit" bull shit.)
Ritmo, for example, drives me up the wall sometimes but I don't follow him anywhere or attack him for past crimes the moment he shows up. I'm far far from a saint so I don't think that what I'm suggesting as a standard of behavior is so very difficult.
Lem was far more kind, and is undoubtedly far more kind than I am. The post is gently constructed and gently given. I'd be more likely to say... NO ONE admires you for being a dick... so don't be.
Trooper York said...
I would like to hear what Paddy, Freeman and Palladian have to say about this if it is ok with them.
Oh, goddamnit! *flounces*
I am so glad that you asked. Meant to say sorry just now, not glad.
You see, personally, I have preparation for this sort of thing in real life. It has hardened me somewhat, thickened my skin. I do not feel hurt, nor confusion, just disappointment. That's all. Disappointment that something smoother could work out.
But it cannot. Sometimes. Just flat cannot. Not if this is fitting the pattern of the thing real life has prepared me. Due to the new dynamics. We did rejoice when you married but now there is a new dynamic. Two incredibly interesting and engaging and tolerant individual joined and now there is a new thing.
That's how that whole trinity thing started innit.
At any rate there is a new dynamic, for better and for worse, and things change. It's very Buddhist of us to accept that you know.
You controlled that change and we responded. Some responses failed. Incidentally, I very nearly deleted that site when the word "mirror" was mentioned, speaking of dog whistles, but when I went there to do it I noticed nearly 100 comments and it struck me I'd be doing the same unfair thing to erase them.
There are no hard feelings. Just as there are no hard feeling toward the dozen other people I love who abruptly dumped me. Thank you for still talking to me, there's that.
Sorry Chip that I didn't mention you. It was inadvertent.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts. They are very interesting.
bagoh20 said...
"Fen, Revenant and !!!Father Fox!!! are down in the booze thread."
Dammit! I just washed the glasses. I'm not cleaning up any more puke around here.
*************
LOL!
I think Father Fox is down there calling them all a bunch of fems for diluting the booze with sugar poppy ginger ale.
Okay, okay--maybe he didn't say it--exactly like that.
Lem: I'm certainly not for bashing Althouse or anyone for that matter. I don't see this blog as a strategic fort in the Althouse War or anything of the sort.
However, despite the various avowals above to move on, Althouse is a pretty natural subject to come up here and I think she is a reaonably interesting subject in the blogosphere. I'm curious how this story works out and I tend to comment on things I'm curious about.
It also seems inevitable that Meade will continue to show up and likely that Althouse will continue to post about us.
Your request is goodhearted, as always, but I question its practicality.
Synova you are the greatest.
My admiration for the way you deliver your opinion, including some of those opinions themselves, doubled when sometime after the Connecticut shooting you went and made a purchased recognized as the best self defense contraption ever devised by man.
Obama threaten our second amendment right and you went and did something that spoke louder than words to show your disapproval.
Just as there are no hard feeling toward the dozen other people I love who abruptly dumped me. Thank you for still talking to me, there's that.
******
I hear ya, or read you Chip.
Those people--the dozen--not so smart.
creely23 see what Synova wrote above.
Now I'm feeling very humbled. Thank you for your kind words, Lem.
creely23 see what Synova wrote above.
Lem: I did read it, but it makes several points and I'm not sure which you are directing me towards.
The practicality is that in the beginning, a tone has to be set. If the tone is bash Althouse, then that is where we will stay. We will just move on to another person or whatever.
Good night.
And while we're on it, and before we leave it, Air Force brathood was preparation for this situation too.
blam. rug snap. over an dover.
Imagine my disappointment when we left the palatial residence on Vandenberg at Barksdale to the tiny place on Inca Street in Colorado. No srsly, that place back there was like a romance novel. The first thing we did was look for slave quarters in back, that's what the house looked like, and all the houses around the neighborhood. Now that right there is a change so abrupt it could kill a lesser being were it not for preparation and the certainty of survival of the death experience.
How about those Red Sox, Lem?
I'm happy to comment about this, though I already did, sort of. I'll expand on both my comment from earlier today, and on an email I sent to a couple of people.
I hold no animus toward Ann Althouse. She's an interesting person, she's a great writer, a great blogger, and I like her a lot; I've actually met her in person a few times and even had her over to my late, lamented loft in Brooklyn. I have always felt a special kinship with her because, like me, she's involved in the visual arts and she's something of an iconoclast. Her discomfort with "acceptable" thinking, and her disinclination to be defined by others really resonates with me. I saw in her writing a political and philosophical nomadism, which I have seen in myself throughout my life, and especially since September 2001.
But as with anyone whom I respect, I have also freely criticized her when I have disagreed with her. I believe that she handled her blog's "break-up" with commenters badly, and I think it's perfectly legitimate to write critically, or even satirically, about that. To me, that's what "living freely in writing" is all about, the freedom to resist the social, political and even personal pressures that force people into external ways of being that aren't true and honest to their inner lives.
I also suspect that there were extenuating circumstances that spurred the recent shutdown of the comments at Althouse. There's a particular "entity" that has been a long-term problem and dealing with the trouble it has caused (you probably have no idea of the extent of the trouble it has caused) would certainly have caused me to think twice about having open comments if I was in Althouse's position.
I also feel like I had some hand in precipitating the comments shutdown, when I wrote of my exasperation with the particularly foul nature of a lot of the commentary about anything related to "gay marriage" or indeed any "gay" topic whatsoever. A number of people thought that my comment was some sort of "goodbye everybody" note (it wasn't), however I think that maybe my comment helped crystallize a similar frustration in Althouse with the tone of some of her commenters, and the way that the ugliest, loudest, stupidest voices were driving away some of the better commenters and more interesting opinions.
The problem with Meade and Althouse's response to all of this, is that they hit back at everyone, not just the "bad-faith" people. I am not one to complain about hyperbole or abrasiveness, but the disproportionate scope and indiscriminate aim of their push-back left me feeling a bit disrespected.
Sure, I read Althouse for her writing, but what made it especially interesting to me, and what kept me around, is that it was also a place to expand upon or riff off of the excellent materials she provided (and provides). I'm a creator. Without making things, or writing things, or drawing things, or fixing things, or designing things, life, to me, isn't worth living. Therefore, I don't spend time on activities that do not allow me to create something. This is why I don't read newspapers, I don't watch most movies or television, and I don't read most blogs. At Althouse's site, it was a way to both enjoy her writing and feel that I was interacting and creating something with my commentary on some of her posts.
That's changed, and I have no bitterness about it. I wasn't sure about this place (Lem's) as I'm not interested in an adjunct site that is full of a bunch of people bitching about Ann Althouse. To my surprise, a lot of her smart, interesting commenters have come here, and Lem has graciously assented to hosting us and our continuing conversations. I see the opportunity here to participate in an interesting group blog experiment. I hope this can happen here.
But a refuge blog full of people lobbing obsessive insults, don't you know that you can count me out.
Palladian, you've beautifully expressed many of my own feelings: in your reasons for appreciating Althouse; the reasons why so many of us have felt hurt by A/M's response; and reasons to feel hopeful and excited about this baby, here.
Palladian said: "To my surprise, a lot of her smart, interesting commenters have come here, and Lem has graciously assented to hosting us and our continuing conversations. I see the opportunity here to participate in an interesting group blog experiment. I hope this can happen here..."
Here is hoping for that.
Based on what I have read and seen on the vlog I cannot think of two people who more deserve each others company than Meade and Ann.
I hope they continue to live in close proximity with each other for many years.
Sorry, but I simply don't have the gene that makes it possible to see passive-aggressive bullshit as anything other than a cowardly attack - the kind that should be punished the most severely because it's not respectable.
It's pretty obvious (after reading all this) the PC "don't bash" bullshit means even statements of fact aren't allowed - which means, just like in the ghetto, the bad guys already rule the roost. So Lem's can't be a place for me.
Goodbye and good night,...
I am perfectly happy moving on. I have no interest in dissecting the Althouse - Commenters divorce. I apparently wasn't following closely as I have no idea what was going on.
All I know is I like reading most of the commenters.
Let's see what happens.
I can't resist a good zinger if it seems right, Althouse or not.
That's what her comments were for.
Zingers can't be moderated, so they go here.
I'd be inclined to just comment on Althouse posts here instead of there, not particularly bashing but just as before, as if the current thread were a comment thread on her blog.
That would be off topic for whatever the head post is, but okay.
As to bashing Althouse, don't be boring. That's the trouble with trolls. Not that they're mean, but that they're uninteresting.
Princess sparkle pony was good, for instance.
I have to remind myself every day that "immature defenses are contagious". And I for one am prone to them.
My mention of "splitting" was not diagnostic, but descriptive of the widely differing reactions offered herein.
Anyway, Synova's prescription seems best. Topped with Paddy's advice, and seasoned with Chip's experience.
And I'll be thankful most for what has been, for it made all these people known to me.
Well said, Lem.
I didn't realize the Althouse Cafe thread was open or that's where she served the divorce papers.
IMO, she's suffering from Stage 1 blogger burnout. Focusing on just her writing and not wasting time on the comments is probably a good thing
There was an episode of the old Star Trek where some space alien manipulated everybody's minds on board the Enterprise to keep them all fighting because the space alien ate people's emotions as its food.
The thing of it was, the people fighting each other were getting something out of it, too.
I was pretty young at the time but I think that maybe that episode was written as an allegory that expressed opposition to the Vietnam war.
"I didn't realize the Althouse Cafe thread was open "
Exactly. Eventually, most Althouse commenters did not read Athouse. Some now feel hurt that all commenters were cut off. But as most here reveal, they weren't there to read her blog posts. Now why would an artist keep throwing parties, at his own expense, for more and more people who have no interest in the artist's work?
For Fen: http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/172737/
I thought Freeman Hunt's comment a few days about resisting lashing out was well said. Have I been cruel to Ann and Meade? Perhaps a play of cruel unneutrality. Still, that does not make me Mary.
I am all for moving on. Meade should probably take up that advice himself.
If, however, the goal is to create a place, then what gets read would not be the point.
Place meaning place for people.
I'm suggesting that that, for women, is the attraction.
"I also suspect that there were extenuating circumstances that spurred the recent shutdown of the comments at Althouse. There's a particular "entity" that has been a long-term problem and dealing with the trouble it has caused (you probably have no idea of the extent of the trouble it has caused) would certainly have caused me to think twice about having open comments if I was in Althouse's position."
I'm quoting out this part of Palladian's comment because it's usually absent from people's explanations for why the comments were shut down when, in fact, it was the key element. Althouse is not the first blogger to limit comments because of this "entity's" actions.
And maybe it all worked out. While I greatly miss the comments, it does seem that the actual posts over there have been especially good since we left. And we can comment here, so it's all good.
"Place meaning place for people.
I'm suggesting that that, for women, is the attraction."
Revealed: RH is woman!
Hear him comment.
Agree with rc on the idea she's burned out. 20+ posts most days would do that to anybody.
Trooper York said...
So let me get this straight.
Althouse has closed her comment section to all but the selected toadys, lickspittles and teachers pets while bashing her commenters in every other post.
She's calmed down a little.
The last couple of days one or two posts would be open to comments.
Yesterday, she did "moderated" comments (you submit; if she approves, she lets it display).
AFAIK, pretty much anybody that was civil was allowed to comment.
We'll see what happens next.
PS and FWIW:
Insta is back to linking to Ann, so it may be safe to say that, except for a few of the implacable, people may be calming down.
Woman doesn't have a place because creating places is her place.
Woman finds it satisfying.
Guys just go out and kill stuff.
ed: She is not burned out. The exact opposite is true.
Freeman said " it does seem that the actual posts over there have been especially good" and Freeman IS RIGHT!
"Guys just go out and kill stuff."
Not just. Guy who wants woman hunts, kills, brings back meat, makes a place, invites woman. If woman likes the way guy keeps his place kept parasite-free, woman stays, has bite to eat, and bears his children. Rinse. Repeat.
There must also be beverage.
"The comments of those posts that link to her, should not be taken as opportunity to bash her."
Could you have just said "Those posts that link to her should not be taken as an opportunity to bash her"?
Woman is beverage.
BREAKING!! A fish does need a bicycle after all!!
bibō bibis bibit bibimus bibitis bibunt babe beer
Obama defends Obamacare
"If the folks who have been trying to make political hay out of this thing, if they had some better ideas, I've already told them I'm happy to hear them. But I haven't heard any so far," Obama said. "What I've heard is just the same old song and dance. We're just going to blow through that stuff."
2+2=4 is old news.
"BREAKING!! A fish does need a bicycle after all!!"
Unless the fish is a lesbian fish. Lesbian fish only need the bicycle seat.
Re: "Lesbian fish only need the bicycle seat."
At the Lesbian Hot Dog Stand they Sell Fish Corn-Dogs. Really, the Fish Corn-Dog is just a Fish-stick on a Stick, but it Adds Depth to the Menu. And Innuendo: Lesbians are All About Innuendo. At Least Phonetically.
Are there cities named after fish?
They could replace Vienna and Frankfurt in the designation.
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