The National Park Service erected barricades to shut down parking lots surrounding Mount Vernon despite the fact that the tourist destination is privately owned, another example of how the feds are deliberately worsening the government shut down.
Mount Vernon is the former plantation of George Washington and is owned by the Mount Vernon Ladies’ Association, which doesn’t receive any government funding. The attraction’s official website reads, “NO SHUTDOWN HERE – The Federal government may be shut down, but Washington’s home remains open. Mount Vernon has remained a private non-profit for more than 150 years.”
169 comments:
That tag predated this post.
I'm just saying.
The democrat party hates you.
Lem, that should be spelled "barrycade".
Also at the story are examples of things being closed that require more manpower CLOSED than OPEN. But hey, this, like the sequester, is really about letting the little people know that they have to kiss Obama's half-white ass at all times.
Barrycade. ha.
But McCain would have been worse, right?
And now the Democrats will have to "own this", just like they they "own" their foreign policy mistakes, right?
This would all be fixed by Republicans embracing gay marriage and illegal immigration..
Harry Reid says kids with cancer can go fuck themselves, and it's the GOP's fault. MSM agrees. He doesn't own that, I guess.
I saw it on Drudge, April. I don't know if he cribbed it from someone else.
But McCain would have been worse, right?
Well, McCain DID want to go to war with Russia a few years ago over the former Soviet Republic of Georgia.
Otherwise it would have probably been a wash, as McCain probably wouldn't have thought to "reform" healthcare, but would have given everyone in the world US citizenship.
McCain would not have been worse but it's a false choice at this point in time.
That ship has sailed.
The lesson is - Karl Rove needs to go pound sand.
And now the Democrats will have to "own this", just like they they "own" their foreign policy mistakes, right?
It's a good thing I recognize our bitter irony, or I'd be responding to this stuff all day.
Oh, wait a minute....
All your parks are belong to us!
"Barrycade" was coined on Legal Insurrection on Tuesday. As of yesterday, it's official (in the Urban Dictionary)!
1. barrycade
1. A barrier (usually temporary) that exists for no reason.
2. A barrier erected for political reasons.
“Dude, Obama barrycaded the park.”
“Hey, let’s put up some barrycades to keep those World War II veterans away from the open-air World War II Memorial in Washington, D.C., in order to try and score some cheap political points.”
We don't have "media" in America. We have a Democrat protection racket.
That whole thing about Obama being "a nice guy" and "likeable" has been a big farce.
The biggest lie of all.
MugabeCare Über Alles!
Armut macht frei!
All your parks are belong to us!
Also? Bad park, you!
Now some MugabeCare exchanges are offering free MugaePhones to entice signing up.
I wonder if pretty soon I'm gonna be forced to give illegal immigrants baths and towel them off?
Or will I just have to bow to them at sunrise, say a prayer aloud to the gay marriage gods, and then slink off to work each morning?
If there were only more days in the week so I could generate more money for Dear Leader Mugabe to spend. And I am heartily sorry for not being wise and good enough to live off the dole. My work is my shame, so I must do more of it.
Governor Scott Walker of Wisconsin told the national park service to take a flying fuck. The NPS told Wisconsin to close everything, and Walker opened up all of the parks, boat landings and other stuff that was not on federal land.
Fuck off, Obama.
The nice guy thing was an attempt at covering over the fact that Obama was never vetted, still to this day. And that has all to do with the lingering specter of the race card Obama holds over those in a position to check him.
The constitution never contemplated a paralyzed citizenry, in the face of a president's ability to cower them into submission.
It's fucked up is what it is.
I wonder if pretty soon I'm gonna be forced to give illegal immigrants baths and towel them off?
Or will I just have to bow to them at sunrise, say a prayer aloud to the gay marriage gods, and then slink off to work each morning?
The latter should be sufficient, but only if the IT people get the websites functioning before November. After that you will have to do both.
All Governors should be pressured to open their state's national parks.
Come on Utah.
"The bullshit piled up so fast in Vietnam you needed wings to stay above it.”
-- Apocalypse Now (1979)
The radical leftists who lord over us are lashing out with hatred and anger because their welfare scam called PelosiCare is crashing and burning.
Bad Barrycade you.
The media and the democrat party have lost their minds.
tea party -waaaaa!
April, this should really be called ReidCare. The final bill was written by Reid and a couple of other Senators and their staffs after shunting the bill from the regular legislative process to the budgeting process, so as to avoid a filibuster. Obama, as usual, "led" from behind, and because of the constraints in the Senate parliamentary procedures, Pelosi more or less had to swallow Reid's bill.
Here we are in Day Three of the Obama shutdown, and you know who is being impacted?
No one.
A few government employees will have their pay deferred a bit, but that's an occupational risk one accepts when being hired by the government. Can't feel bad for them; they knew that deal going in.
No one.
Markets are open, FBI is on the case, courts are open, NSA is a-spyin' on us, school kids are getting lunches, IRS is still harassing conservative organizations, and so on.
Park Service employees who are erecting barrycades run away when someone points a camera at them and asks their names.
I say to Boehner "Stay with it!" The Dems and the President look more and more like the fascist dictators they are, and people are beginning to realize that.
Here we are in Day Three of the Obama shutdown, and you know who is being impacted?
No one.
I'm not sure about that, Haz. The first two days of the shutdown I fell asleep in the middle of the afternoon while trying to get my daughter to take her naps. That doesn't usually happen. It just COULD be the government shutdown....
Ice.. Pelosi's high paid ultra leftwing progressive staff had plenty of input in those thousands of pages. But sure- ReidCare fits too.
PelosiCare sounds anti-woman and ultra scary. Reid is next in line on the scary scale. After Reid's anti-child hissy fit, I'd say the left are at war with our children.
It's time Americans understood there is a war going on. The democrat war on women and kids with cancer.
Icepick - you might have been hacked. Kids are into that at an early age.
Obama shut down the NASA website, among others.
In trying to get my head around that, the only thing I can come up with is that Obama holds so little regard for the people that he is supposed to serve, that he believes that shutting down a website, cannot possibly be seen by the public in any other light other than the one he tells them.
The kind of arrogance needed to do that was the kind of arrogance on display when he told people to vote out of revenge.
Remember that?
I was amazed to see how almost nobody check him on that. Obama got very little to no push back on that revenge thing.
Claire McCatkill(D) was out yesterday whining about the tea party.
The left and their media hacks have no-where to turn but one gigantic blame the tea party fest.
Democrats hate ordinary Americans who pay their taxes.
@April:
Exactly. They despise the makers, the lifters, and praise the takers, the leaners.
In their perfect world, I would build a house, save some money and then hand it over to an unemployed noncitizen, and then go do it again.
I'm increasingly sickened by thought of the leisured class of the never-employed mocking me for being stupid enough to work and yelling at me to work harder goddamnit because I need a new phone and I need my OxyContin prescription paid for, so MOVE IT!!!.
I think everyone should constantly mock the left and the media for their tea party obsession.
Democrats hate ordinary Americans.
Icepick - you might have been hacked. Kids are into that at an early age.
No kidding. She's not even three years and four months yet, and she's already mastered both my wife's and my cell phone to a large extent, and is increasingly proficient on the home computer. For the most part, she has learned all this just by watching us and fooling around with stuff when we weren't looking. Just how they learn to walk, talk, etc. And she did wake up sooner than I did on both days, leaving me asleep on Tuesday while she came out and played on the computer.
Kids!
Obama as Ike Turner:
"America, Baby, Don't You See It's Because I Love You So Much?"
Obama as Ike Turner:
"Americans Be Thinkin's Too Much."
...The oven is electric.
tea party to blame.
Obama as Ike Turner:
"Sometimes These WWII Veterans Needs a Bitch Slap, That's All."
Obama as Ike Turner:
"That Bitch America Ain't Nothin' Without Me."
Obama's America.
Obama as Ike Turner:
"America, I Can Tap Your Ass Anytimes I Wanta."
Obama as Ike Turner:
"Can't I Just Eat My Damn Waffle Without No Backtalk?"
Obama as Ike Turner:
"America, You Was Nothin' Before I Met You. Now Shut the Hell Up and Play That Tambourine."
Obama as Ike Turner:
"Honey, You Know I Get a Little Crazy Sometimes. It's Only Cause You Keep Pushin' at Me."
Obama as Ike Turner:
"Sometimes Those Tea Party Bitches Need a Pimp Hand to Keep Them in Line."
Obama as Ike Turner:
"America, You Know You Love Me - You Just Don't Know it Hard Enough Sometimes, That's All."
to a lesser degree Google.
But Goldman Sachs is 100% pure evil.
Icepick said...
April, this should really be called ReidCare. The final bill was written by Reid and a couple of other Senators and their staffs after shunting the bill from the regular legislative process to the budgeting process, so as to avoid a filibuster. Obama, as usual, "led" from behind, and because of the constraints in the Senate parliamentary procedures, Pelosi more or less had to swallow Reid's bill.
Sorry to dispute you, but the PPACA is appropriately named Obamacare. It would never have reached Harry Reid's domain if it were not for the extortion meeting Obama and Pelosi had with Michigan Representative Bart Stupak, a Blue-Dog Democrat who controlled about 7 votes in the House....all needed to pass the PPACA.
Stupak was against the PPACA and wasn't going to vote for it...until he decided in a meeting with Obama and Pelosi that he,at age 59, needed to spend more time with his family and go in to private law practice.
Obama got his votes and lost a seat to Republicans, but no matter, he got what HE wanted when HE wanted it.
Obama as Ike Turner:
"America, Baby, Don't You Remember All the Good Times? Hope and Change Is Just Gonna Hurt a Little, Sometimes."
Pogo said ...
If there were only more days in the week so I could generate more money for Dear Leader Mugabe to spend. And I am heartily sorry for not being wise and good enough to live off the dole. My work is my shame, so I must do more of it.
Lem said ...
The constitution never contemplated a paralyzed citizenry, in the face of a president's ability to cower them into submission.
I couldn't say it any better than either Pogo or Lem. Lem nails it...we are in a state of paralysis. We no longer rule ourselves, or manage our budget, which doesn't exist anymore, through our elected representatives.
It says something ugly about the rest of us when it takes a bunch of octogenarians, WWII veterans, to say fuck off to the NPS and Obama et al.
Ice - no one here would dispute that the way the democrats pushed Obamacare through was dishonorable.
In the senate, they made sure to sneak it through right before Scott Brown was sworn in.
Otherwise the senate did not have the party line votes.
The Demos really know how to dig a hole, don't they?
How can we be sure the PBMAA isn't behind all this shutdown business?
The Portable Barricade Manufacturers Association of America!!!
Let us not forget dear Max Baucus(D). -
Max, a good loyal democrat, supported it, helped write it, signed off on it, and voted for it.. then he escaped out the back door after the shit hit the fan.
April, that picture is pretty stark. And somehow it reminds me of Richard Nixon sneaking out to the Lincoln Memorial in the middle of the night to talk to anti-war protestors. Can you even imagine such a thing today?
Ari, Obama's election and pressure from his Administration made it possible to get something passed, but the particular something ultimately had much more of Pelosi's and especially Reid's staffs work than Obama's or the Administration's work.
Ignore the democrat's failures... because...
tea party!
Yep. Make it as difficult as you can. And Icepick is right. It is costing MORE to keep some things closed....like parking lots....than it would to just leave it alone. It is all about showing us who is in charge.
It appears though that Scott Walker isn't playing that game. When told by the Feds to close State parks the feds were told to shove it. Paraphrasing :-)
Hubby and I talked about it this morning. We had just been on a day trip to scout out some future camping locations in a local National Forest....we are surrounded by National forests (multiple ones). At many of the camping areas it was dirt roads, some metal firepits and an occasional picnic table. No other facilities. No one is 'manning' these areas. A few camps that are more developed with an actual pit toilet have a sign and a drop box for people to put their money in, on the honor system. It also appears that many of the "campers" are actually more permanent than just being tourists. In addition it is deer season coming up in some areas for bow hunters and many people are out scouting the area for that. Other areas are day use camps where people park and hike down to the creek or river for trout fishing.
Seriously...you think a few hastily erected barrycades are going to stop people from entering the national forest? Really?
Even if there is a fence or chain put across the road.....anyone heard of bolt cutters.
This intimidation tactic by the administration is not going to play well outside of the blue states.
"The Demos really know how to dig a hole, don't they?"
You'd think huh. This is probably the worst optics possible, but so was Obama going to sleep during Benghazi and going off to Vegas for a fundraiser the next morning, but what happened? He's gone golfing or on vacation at some of the worst times, and nothing much is said.
The IRS punishing nonprofit organizations for politics also goes nowhere. The ugliness of those New Black Panthers at the polling place, or voting locations having 100% or even higher Democratic votes.
There is something horribly wrong with our citizens who seem to voluntarily accept their blindness on these things. The Republicans as bad and Democrats as good fantasy is so deeply entrenched in the stupid and well- educated alike that truth has little to do with anything anymore. People only need to have a clue about which side of the argument is pushed by which team and then they know everything they need to have an opinion.
If Obama was caught on video beating a baby seal to death with a dead puppy, many would blame the puppy.
Icepick ... no argument from me about whose staffs did the illiterate text work. Obama does not work per se. My point was that Obama forced it through the House by extortion. Bart Stupak was a good man and fair represented his District. That Obama was able to cow himn is why you have the PPACA today, otherwise it would never have left the House.
DBQ said ..
It is all about showing us who is in charge.
Yes it is, and all planned well in advance.
It is a very short step from arbitrary autocracy to tyrannical aristocracy. WE are quite close to the latter. Let's see what his nibs does in 2016?
If Obama was caught on video beating a baby seal to death with a dead puppy, many would blame the puppy.
He didn't club that.
I wonder if they're deliberately courting a "Middle-Class Anarchy" response? Once you break one barricade, the psychological effort involved in keeping on going is... reduced. Shit has momentum, is all I'm saying.
News from the shutdown:
Troops Forage for Food While Golfers Play On in Shutdown
Lead paragraph: Grocery stores on Army bases in the U.S. are closed. The golf course at Andrews Air Force base is open.
Prioritizing, is what this is!
News from the ObamaCare front:
Need health care coverage? Just dial 1-800-F**KYO to reach Obamacare’s national hotline
This one is SLIGHTLY misleading. The actual number to dial at Health and Human Services to get lists of providers is 1-800-318-2596, which spells out 1-800-F1UC-KYO. The Daily Caller also mentions Obama's propensity to flick the bird at his audience while speaking, as El Pollo has pointed out in the past.
Really, this whole Presidency is just a giant performance art project, in which one Barack Hussein Obama tells everyone to fuck off and laughs about it.
Thank you, Democratic voters, for doing such an outstanding job of shitting on the country.
Mitch H. said...
I wonder if they're deliberately courting a "Middle-Class Anarchy" response
Democrats don't want anarchy from Middle America. They want you to go to work every day so they can redistribute your earnings to Elizabeth Warren, Ward Churchill, and the staff at ACORN's children. They're doing this because it never ocurred to them their media allies wouldn't be able to spin it in their favor.
bagoh20 said...
The Demos really know how to dig a hole, don't they?
You'd think huh. This is probably the worst optics possible, but so was Obama going to sleep during Benghazi and going off to Vegas for a fundraiser the next morning, but what happened? He's gone golfing or on vacation at some of the worst times, and nothing much is said.
But somebody's hearing about it. That's why Choom is at 45% approval (it's probably worse).
And the bit with the WWII vets is all over the 'Net.
He tried this during the sequester and it didn't work. I don't think it's going to this time, either.
Obama is now warning that if the shutdown continues the likelihood of default will increase. Translation: the faux President of The United States is trying to panic the financial sector and crash the market. He is deliberately talking down the economy. Our anti-president, rather than give an inch, WANTS ROME TO BURN.
Obvious Shutdown Theater. Closing open-air parks, 90 year old WWII vets denied entry to public square.
Government Comes First, Cancer Kids can die.
The optics are so obviously bad for the statists but the media keeps spinning, spinning, spinning for Obama and the Dems (and whatever Republican happens to say something helpful for Obama and the Dems). It's axiomatic that the Republican Party is Stoopid and Bad because they can't get their message out but how can you get your message out if no one will publish it? Or it gets published in a demeaning way, as a joke or as an example of the "Extreme Right Wing Hate Machine" or otherwise contextualized to allow the viewer to dismiss it. Even Fox, Karl Rove's playground, constant chitchatter about the group of "moderate" Republicans who will "negotiate" with the Democrats. Excuse me, who is explicitly refusing to negotiate? Thank God for the internet. I think a lot of people learned from the sequester debacle that Barry Barrycade is willing, eager, to play political games. It's finally dawning on a whole new group of people for the first time that he's a politician. And an asshole. And a liar. It's a little late, friends, but welcome to the table. Enjoy your "cake."
Obvious Shutdown Theater. Closing open-air parks, 90 year old WWII vets denied entry to public square.
Government Comes First, Cancer Kids can die.
The optics are so obviously bad for the statists but the media keeps spinning, spinning, spinning for Obama and the Dems (and whatever Republican happens to say something helpful for Obama and the Dems). It's axiomatic that the Republican Party is Stoopid and Bad because they can't get their message out but how can you get your message out if no one will publish it? Or it gets published in a demeaning way, as a joke or as an example of the "Extreme Right Wing Hate Machine" or otherwise contextualized to allow the viewer to dismiss it. Even Fox, Karl Rove's playground, constant chitchatter about the group of "moderate" Republicans who will "negotiate" with the Democrats. Excuse me, who is explicitly refusing to negotiate? Thank God for the internet. I think a lot of people learned from the sequester debacle that Barry Barrycade is willing, eager, to play political games. It's finally dawning on a whole new group of people for the first time that he's a politician. And an asshole. And a liar. It's a little late, friends, but welcome to the table. Enjoy your "cake."
edutcher said...
He tried this during the sequester and it didn't work. I don't think it's going to this time, either.
Part of the reason this is backfiring so obviously is that the Democrats just did it during sequester by closing the White House to visitors. It's a recognized bureaucratic budget maneuver to first cut the programs most important to outsiders. Because the outsiders don't have the knowledge required to identify a better set of cuts you can't prove them wrong. It's hard to develop that knowledge, and those whose jobs most closely tie into finding them aren't interested because they're Democratic Party mouthpieces.
In the private sector this gets you fired, but in a government with a Democratic Administration you're a hero.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/bureaucrats-at-tiny-federal-agency-fmcs-buy-legions-of-luxuries-with-purchase-cards/article/2536649
I wonder how many of these guys are at work today. Apparently they're all working through the sequester.
Obama is now warning that if the shutdown continues the likelihood of default will increase. Translation: the faux President of The United States is trying to panic the financial sector and crash the market
The financial sector is not fooled by Obama's rhetoric. The default likelihood is already baked into the cake. The Market, if you mean the uneducated investor...the small investor...well, that's a different story. The odd lot theory while not as popular as previously, still has some merit.
"The technical theory that holds that an investor should make investment decisions contrary to what the odd-lotters, on balance, are doing. For example, if odd-lot sales exceed odd-lot purchases, the odd-lot theory says that the smart investor should buy. Conversely, if odd-lot purchases exceed odd-lot sales, the theory says that the smart investor should sell. The odd-lot theory is based on the premise that small investors who trade in odd lots tend to make the wrong decisions."
In my experience the uncontrolled, small investor almost always make stupid decisions based on emotion. Panic enough of the sheeple and you will have a run on the market. For every seller....there is a buyer.
The real crunch or disaster will be when the Treasury auction of our debt (bonds) is not successful because other countries and larger investors will not want to buy at the low interest rates we have and with the obvious and well known degradation of the credit standing of the United States. The auction will fail and all hell will break lose. \
An older article but a prescient one.
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/05/08/terrible-treasury-auction-exposes-hole-in-obama-econ-plan/
The only things keeping us afloat and avoiding out of control inflation or even hyperinflation... so far has been the massive pumping of newly printed money into the system and the fact that much of the rest of the world is in even worse economic shape than we are. However....Obama is also rapidly changing that dynamic. Hang on people. It is going to be a very bumpy ride.
I am soooooo glad that I am retired from this business.
The hysteria engendered by a medical insurance program that covers a fraction of the population is remarkable. It is a shame that the overall cost of health care, which is an actual problem undermining our country's economic competitiveness, doesn't get the same level of attention.
For every seller....there is a buyer
Eventually....I might add. If the stock reaches a low enough price...a buyer will emerge. Eventually.
If the bonds aren't priced right aka....interest rate too low relative to the risk. Eventually a buyer will emerge, when the interest rate is high enough to compensate for the risk and the terms are agreeable.
Not good for us in the peanut gallery. But...this is why some people have all the money, and we don't.
DBQ, primary dealers are OBLIGATED to buy US Treasuries. At the moment that makes for a good deal, because a lot of the Treasuries can then be sold to the FED at a small mark-up. But given the volumes involved, a large deficit is actually a plus for the big financial players.
The real problem will come if interest rates start climbing, or when tax revenues aren't enough to cover interest on the debt. Very bad things start happening then.
Exactly, Icepick.
The Fed is basically creating, selling and then buying back its own debt. Right now the interest rate and the spread is low. It is artificially sustainable for now. But eventually, when there is no buyer on the secondary market things will need to change.
The real problem will come if interest rates start climbing, or when tax revenues aren't enough to cover interest on the debt. Very bad things start happening then.
Bingo.
The hysteria engendered by a medical insurance program that covers a fraction of the population is remarkable.
Oh, so only a fraction of the population is mandated to have insurance by Jan 1, 2014? Well then, as I have now been educated; would you mind telling us what the determining method is for what fraction is required to have insurance and what fraction is not?
So far [according to the news anecdotes I have read], it sounds like most Obamacare applicants are being shuffled into their state Medicaid program. So much for offering more choice and more options.
ricpic said ...
President of The United States is trying to panic the financial sector and crash the market. He is deliberately talking down the economy.
The Cloward-Piven strategy writ large. It IS the whole point of it.
" It is a shame that the overall cost of health care, which is an actual problem undermining our country's economic competitiveness, doesn't get the same level of attention."
Bullshit!
My company's only real competition is China, and we have quite affordably provided insurance for our employees for decades. We have competed just fine. Taxes on the other hand rob us of roughly half our profit that would go to growing our business and hiring and training more tax payers.
After all these years, it's Obamacare that might end our company's ability to provide insurance and hire people. It's a lose - lose, and especially for our people who need a lift the most. Remember, everybody was getting needed health care already, insured or not. I've had over a 1000 employees and never heard of a single one who was denied care when they needed it, including the ones without insurance.
Sure the old system was unfair too, with us insured ones paying for the freeloaders, but Obamacare does not eliminate freeloaders, as seen by the news out today where people who formerly paid for insurance are now being sent to medicaid and turned from contributors into dependents by the millions in addition to the ones who were already dependent and will remains so. We are just creating more dependency, and the fraud in this new system will be the biggest financial crime in history of the planet, as we turn our citizen into low level criminals, and provide for easy identity theft as a side benefit for the Russian mafia.
I hear you guys about how bad this looks for the Dems, and how that's even starting to get out, but that is not enough, because in the end, it will still be mostly blamed on Republicans, much will go down the memory hole, and after it all Republicans will still be considered evil greedy racists who millions of idiots wouldn't support if the opposing Democrat was raping their dog every Tuesday, and not even giving a reach around.
AnUnreasonableTroll said...
The hysteria engendered by a medical insurance program that covers a fraction of the population is remarkable.
Reasonable people get a bit perturbed when the government tries to force them to do something that is unconstitutional, but it's OK.
Nobody can sign up anyway because the thing is so poorly set up, so it's irrelevant, I guess.
The unthinkingconcerntroll Obamabotfanboy is not worth your time and energy. His earnest eeyore inquiries are laughably oblivious because they are progressive talking points, not because they're actual concerns.
I agree with Bago.
In one example I read a law student had been paying $2,400 per year for a school sponsored policy and now Obamacare has "navigated" him into a Medicaid policy which is cost-free to him but not to we the taxpayers.
So, someoe tell me again how Obamacare won't increase our deficit?
Amartel- agreed and I love the way these libs picked user id's like The Moderate Voice or ARM. Jeez, next Ritmo will be using an ID like "Middle of the Road Voter".
So, someoe tell me again how Obamacare won't increase our deficit?
It just doesn't, now shut-up.
"it will still be mostly blamed on Republicans, much will go down the memory hole"
All true, thanks to the media spinning for Obama. BUT, the idea has been planted: Maybe God is just like every other politician. Then wait for Obamacare (or some other progressive taking) to affect the LIV personally.
LIV loves to savor the bountiful flavor of giving away other peoples' money but shit gets real when it's his or her own dough.
" I love the way these libs picked user id's like The Moderate Voice or ARM"
Haha, exactly. IndependentVoter.
It IS a concerning concern and I'm outrageously outraged.
Howabout some honesty:
ProgressiveHackosaurus FederalEmployeeHardAtWork
(heh, hardatwork, that works)
RubberRumpusRoom
LoisLerner'sHusband
WhateverOSez
PermanentlyDisabledStudent
UniversityDiversityProfessor
(BTW, the "A" in AMartel stands for Awesome.)
"LoisLernersHusband" good one!
The problem with MugabeCare (and most complex legislation) is that the Congressional staffers who actually write the laws have almost NO real-world experience. IIRC a study published in Newsweek circa 1982 stated that the avg age of Congressional staffers on the tax-writing committies in both houses was 26 and almost ALL owned NO assets of ANY kind save their cars--no stocks, bonds, annuties, cash-value life insurance, homes--you name it. Almost all were very bright Ivy League grads who went from school straight to Capitol Hill w.o. spending a day in the real world. Oh, they knew all about the relevant theories of taxation and tax law but had no real-world experience as to how uit actually worked out as applied to real people and business concerns--yet they were writing the legislation that would significantly alter the lives of everyone--everyone but themselves.
Dare I say that the same may undoubtedly be said of those staffers who cobbled together MugabeCare?...legislation produced by very bright people with NO real-world healthcare experience but with very definite ideological axes to grind. It all reminds me of the British social philosopher/mathemitician and supreme lefty Bertrand Russell who, when confronted with the news by his grad students that his social theories of how society should work didn't fit the facts as found in the real world, famously egotistically declared: "Well, so much worse for the facts."
Russell's attitude perfectly reflects the insanely overconfident attitude of the too-clever-by-half left in a nutshell.
Too bad for the little people, the ship-of-state may founder, but the nomenklutura will survive to the last, sitting in the crow's nest eating the last of the passengers rations and thinking they can bend reality to fit their own distorted perceptions.
"After all these years, it's Obamacare that might end our company's ability to provide insurance and hire people."
Here, here. We've provided 100% employer-paid insurance to our employees over the years, but the cost noose has constricted significantly during the past couple years with things like mandatory coverage until 26 and no lifetime limits along with burdensome new administration. Now the Obama crew is considering outlawing re-insurance to make sure no self-insured, small business program like ours can exist. Sorry in advance to all of our employees who'll be dumped onto the exchange.
The democrat party HATES half of the nation.
HATE.
I don't recall GWB hating half the nation or treating half the nation with contempt.
Sweet. Infowars! You can definitely trust 9/11 conspiracy theorists to dutifully report accurate accounts!
Virgil has it correct. The law(s) are being written by people with no real world experience.
Instead of getting input from doctors, hospital managers, insurance specialists (not the companies who stand to make big bucks off of this) who could explain the existing system. Explain what is wrong and what has been driving up costs. Explain the actual ramifications of their laws. Explain how people WILL game the system. Get some real IT people to explain how impossible it is to set up such a complex data gathering, storing and sharing program. Explain what the dangers in such a system could be for hackers and identity theft.
Instead of all this, they just cobbled together a Frankenstein monster of a bill. Now when it is apparent that the monster is uncontrollable, they refuse to even consider a re-do. A re-write.
Instead of going through the process of legally making changes the Obama administration is illegally granting willy nilly waivers and refusing to consider suggestions from people who KNOW the industry.
Ideology trumps common sense.
We are so very very screwed.
Oh God, Bunny.
It would be rhetorical to ask if you actually knew what percentage of HCWs, physicians and hospitals oppose rather than support the bill, so I guess I'm just going to have to let you stew in your gloom. Facts must follow feelings, of course.
Go ahead, Ritmo, tell us what percentage of HCWs, physicians and hospitals support the bill.
Balls knows. He watched men and women in lab coats, who were not paid actors or democrats+. No no.
They were real on the gov.gov.com youtubes.
Well, I'm sure you wouldn't. But Bunny is usually (slightly) less research-averse so I'm disappointed that she didn't.
http://www.healthcare-informatics.com/news-item/majority-physicians-support-supreme-court-aca-decision
http://www.ereleases.com/pr/poll-finds-60-percent-physician-leaders-support-supreme-court-decision-aca-82325
http://cmhmd.blogspot.com/2010/02/organized-medicine-on-hcr-updated-again.html
Any other points you wished to, um, not make?
Even if it were only that it would still be more accurate than the garbage that Adam Apple pulls out of her cooch.
Majority of Doctors don't want ObamaCare#1
Majority of Doctors don't want ObamaCare#2
Majority of Doctors don't want ObamaCare#3
You can title those whatever you want. The second and third provide no polling stats, and the second one isn't even about the ACA but about medical boutique practices that are hardly new. Apparently you got confused because the essay uses words like "bureaucratic" and "interference". Doesn't mean it's about the ACA. And the first one wasn't even about the ACA but about 2012 election preferences. Which came between the guy who signed the ACA and the guy who pushed for it and signed it on the state level in his own state of Massachusetts.
Weak.
Every physician organization supported it, including physician executives. How does one say the physician executives are wrong? You are offering applesauce in response.
From your first link, dear Balls--
This is interesting:
According to an online poll of physicians in hospital, health systems, and large group practices across the U.S., more than 60 percent of respondents say the U.S. Supreme Court's recent decision to uphold the Affordable Care Act was the right one. The poll, which was sent via email to about 9,500 physician leaders who are members of the American College of Physician Executives (ACPE), drew 617 responses. Of those, 61.1 percent said they supported the court's decision, while 33.4 opposed. An additional 5.5 percent were unsure.
Out of 9500 - only 617 responded.
And out of the 617 who did respond, 61% say they support the ACA.
Maff.
The second link confirms it:
The unscientific poll, which was sent via email to about 9,500 physician leaders who are members of the American College of Physician Executives (ACPE), drew 617 responses. Of those, 61.1 percent said they supported the court’s decision, while 33.4 opposed. An additional 5.5 percent were unsure.
Yes. 61% support is a response in favor.
What's your problem anyway? Are you saying the response rate in a voluntary survey are too low to be considered as serious as your lack of any polling data? (Except the data polling the wrong question, and the fact that you mistook opinion-analysis pieces as polling surveys!)
You really are one worm-filled Apple, Adam. You don't even seem to know what your argument is, let alone how to make it.
I remember Karl Rove making the same argument you're making on the night of the 2012 election. Just wait for the results from Hamilton County! Romney will take Ohio in an historic landslide! LOL!
The AMA, American College of Physicians and the majority of medical journals are run by leftists, just like the MSM.
They won't print an article critical of MugabeCare, There won't be a poll that isn't positive about it. Been that way a long time. There isn't an honest MD survey anywhere.
Forget it, Jake, it's Leftytown.
The polling results are too low! America's physicians remember the historic injustice done to Ohio's Hamilton County! Let's wait for some better figures! The leadership of all our organizations doesn't represent us!
LOL. LOL. LOL.
Roflmao. Lol.
RITMO mistakes highly politicized leftist organizations like the AMA (which has a very small minority of non-academic/research working physicians as members, btw) for the vast majority of physicians in pvt practice--the vast majority of which DO oppose MugabeCare.
April, you are on pretty weak ground on this one. Physicians and hospitals are generally in favor of universal health coverage, for a variety of reasons.
"Are you saying the response rate in a voluntary survey are too low to be considered as serious..."
Yes. A 6.5% response rate is too low to be taken seriously as representative of anything.
It's gibberish.
Oh, right. There you have it. Leftists (nice term, BTW) should be excluded from having opinions in their physician organizations, so sayeth the Pogo.
Pogo, brave soul. Denying health care access is his bread and butter, or so he believes. He says he's not against lifting a monopoly of supply of providers, just lifting the barrier of the restrictions that actually prevented access to routine care to 48 million.
What a guy. A douchebag in little innocent "oppressed citizen's" clothing. Vox populi Pogo speaking out for all the oppressed "non-leftists". Who cares about patient access and affordability? There's ideological oppression afoot!
You're too much, man.
ARM, that means nothing. NO ONE opposes universal health coverage. No one.
How to do that is debated.
No one opposes coverage for all.
No one.
Ten organizations, including executives (not that Pogo would know anything about management), and "MugabeCare" is almost as precious as claiming Kenyan birth.
Keep it up.
But little Pogo says any physician leadership or professional organization in his vocation is inherently corrupt, so there you go. I think it says something about his own professionalism.
Keep it up.
How to do that is debated.
No one opposes coverage for all.
No one.
As a Bircher-type conservative, your whole raison d'etre is to oppose the implementation of anything organized until the end of time. There is no time-table on when you'd render a decision by, because debating is just a tactic you'd use (if you could actually debate) for long enough to prevent a something from taking place.
Even if it were bullshit, executive leadership in medicine is not.
Not that you'd know anything about that. But opposing the opinions of those who do, is something you're all up for.
Hundreds of scientists supported global warming numbers, but that was bullshit, too.
Yes, Ritmo, the majority of MD organizations sold out, to keep the guild in power, to give themselves sinecures. How shocking!
"Even if it were bullshit, executive leadership in medicine is not. "
Of course it is. They are playing along, to keep in the game. If MugabeCare lost, they'd be singing praise to the alternative.
I'm shocked!
Anyway, this whole sub-thread started with Bunny's assertion that input from professionals was never considered. I guess this is your guys' way of conceding defeat on that. Where are the polls claiming they're against it? Where are they?
I'm sure many are taking a cautious "wait and see" attitude.
But I do know one thing: If the number of physicians bent on doing as much to obstruct it were as proportionally strong in the population as the Congressional Tea Party Reprobate-cans, it would still be a pretty insignificant (but loud) minority.
April, one thing to remember with MDs is that there have been large demographic changes in this profession. It is gradually becoming a female dominated profession with a increasing fraction of asians. What you hear from your older male primary care physician bears little relationship to the what younger people in large hospitals think.
Hundreds of scientists supported global warming numbers, but that was bullshit, too.
Not it wasn't and it isn't.
Yes, Ritmo, the majority of MD organizations sold out, to keep the guild in power, to give themselves sinecures. How shocking!
Don't your patients find the tinfoil around your stethoscope to be a bit off-putting?
It must be fun that you can no longer find even a single, related business interest willing to support your Bircherism any more on this. Apparently the markets themselves are too corrupt for your kind of purity.
The only purity you believe in any more is the denial of coverage purity. Which would be in keeping with your psychological theme, and just as unwittingly evil/amoral as when the insurance bureaucrats were doing it.
But then you didn't complain.
Well, guess what, asshole? Now everybody else feels they can!
Pogo hates it when the lowly are empowered.
By "younger people in large hospitals" ARM means "gullible indoctrinated leftist morons."
GILMs .
Find hundreds on every college campus in the USA.
They are playing along, to keep in the game.
Oh. So they never had an opinion on health care policy before Obama did. Right. What nonsense.
Pole-Glow:
Just putting Napoleonic directional assignments in your conspiracy talk doesn't mean you're not still a fringe whack job. In fact, it shows just how desperate a fringe whack job you are. Not being a right-wing Bircher does not make someone abnormal.
Get used to non-right wingers having opinions and having their input allowed in shaping policy, and stop with the pathetic reliance on labels. They don't work any more. None of the Mad Men-era suits showed up to give you the memo, but that's the reality.
Ritmo, those are really weak. Illogical rejoinders are... Aw fuck it.
Ten organizations, April. You have none.
But Pogo sees professional leadership now as THE ENEMY!
I hope the long gray beard he grows suits him well in the log cabin practice he'll now set up in rural Idaho, where all the right-thinking patients can be so deserving to see someone as privileged as HE!
Weak, you say?
Don't forget to call me a "gullible indoctrinated leftist moron"!
Better yet, make a trendy (as if it would catch on) little acronym out of it. "GILM" That would be cool.
Remember, Pogo: The educated youth are bringing about the destruction OF EVERYTHING!
It would be nice to see you outgrow this persona at some point, but it seems to keep you warm at night.
@ Pogo
A 6.5% response rate is too low to be taken seriously as representative of anything.
It's gibberish.
Yes - thank you - gibberish.
100% crap.
If you have 100 people in a room and you ask everyone a question and only 10 respond - and of those 10 only 6 say "blue"--
You cannot say: "hey, 60% of the people in the room said blue!"
Maff is hard.
Selection bias? Maybe there's a name for what the perpetual deniers and professional denialists seek to label. Maybe it even exists in science.
So the supposed haters of health reform are less motivated to respond, it seems. What a let-down. At least they can rely on people as articulate as Chip Ahoy and Ted Cruz to speak for them, then.
While forgetting the lesson of Green Eggs and Ham.
Pogo said...
By "younger people in large hospitals" ARM means "gullible indoctrinated leftist morons."
Calling them morons seems a little extreme. It has also become increasingly difficult to get into med school, in large part because of the increased participation of these two groups.
Weak ground?
The unscientific poll, which was sent via email to about 9,500 physician leaders who are members of the American College of Physician Executives (ACPE), drew 617 responses. Of those, 61.1 percent said they supported the court’s decision, while 33.4 opposed. An additional 5.5 percent were unsure.
That's some f*ing weak ass ground right there.
I know, April. There are no answers. Ever.
Better to obfuscate than to pronounce a lack of willingness to seek input (as DBQ did and was the whole point of the conversation).
Also, REMEMBER HAMILTON COUNTY! And, Remember the Alamo!
The tally results simply haven't come in, yet. But they will surely save the day.
And also remember, the only people who know anything are GULLIBLE INDOCTRINATED LEFTIST MORONS.
Conservatives are true to their ignorance. (While acting with such self-assuredness over it). The only people who even believe they could know anything are the indoctrinated. Empiricism is evil. There are no answers. Do nothing. Organized action is bad. Leaders are cultists (even in executive management).
Am I leaving any of the rest of you Zen Masters' religious aphorisms out? How many other lazy life lessons do you have to teach us and stamp in bold, graffiti across the land?
Not as weak as your lack of any ground, Coochy Adam's Apple!
I'm pretty sure if you weren't too lazy to quote a poll, let alone conduct one, you wouldn't get the answers you NEED.
But it's ok. Opinion pieces will suffice.
Are you a regular FOX News viewer or just weeknights?
Calm down Ritmo. It'll be OK. Here - take some soma and go to bed.
I'm having fun. The anti-empirical are an endless well of entertainment.
Especially when they live in the 1950s, like Pogo does.
April, so when is the vote tally from Ohio's Hamilton County 2012 election result coming in?
About the same time as that REAL physician poll result on the ACA does?
Do you work with Karl Rove?
Ritmo - Karl Rove can bite my ass and I don't watch Fox News. I don't have Fox News in my cable line up.
Why are you libs so afraid of a little ideological disagreement?
80% of the media is a democrat protection racket and that's still not good enough for you?
Did you brush your teeth? I think you should brush your teeth and march to bed.
ARM, they are morons because they believe in socialism, which is just economic homeopathy.
They are intelligent, I'll give them that. But they are also unforgivably stupid.
Why are you libs so afraid of a little ideological disagreement?
Ideological disagreement is fine but empirical engagement is better.
80% of the media is a democrat protection racket and that's still not good enough for you?
Reality's "liberal bias" is good enough for me. Educated people don't mind free thought, it seems. No conspiracy in that, unless you want to go Full Metal Pogo and declare all education to be bad. If only we could homeschool our study of the classics, between sessions of candle-wax dipping, lead musket-ball making and instruction in log cabin construction. You know, the way it was in "the good old days" before universal, compulsory education. Why did that have to happen?
Did you brush your teeth? I think you should brush your teeth and march to bed.
Methinks someone likes to pretend to be up for the debate that she really ain't.
Physicians for National Health Program
I guess they want to pretend these docs don't exist.
Ritmo - ARM debates in good faith. You, on the other hand, are all over the place like a squirrel on speed.
You fling argumentum ad absurdum and wonder why we all run for the exits.
I'm still waiting for a satisfying response as to why the poll YOU posted doesn't pass the math laugh test. Never mind. Not waiting.
Not. waiting.
Apparently Forbes disagrees with Sir Friedrich Pogo Hayek's contentions.
Not only are physician executives corrupt socialism-enablers, but so is Walmart and Forbes Magazine!
Pole-Glow, your purity is so pure that it blinds all the lesser capitalists. A million capitalists couldn't shine a candle to your white-hot sun of capitalist fusion. The Fortune 500 kneel in awe of your capital-forming entrepreneurship, and beg for lessons in how you single-handedly made the markets we all now rely on.
Please, please tell us your sekrits. You are like the God of Capitalism.
If the ancient Israelites read Hayek, they would have created a golden Pogo.
I'm still waiting for.... Never mind. Not waiting.
Not. waiting.
Oh, lookee here! Who is it again who contradicts herself in the same paragraph and yet believes she argues in "good faith" and not "all over the place?"
I just have more facts and know based on long, hard-earned experience how full-of-doodoo most of these right-wingers are. They argue solely based on belief and facts are irrelevant to them. Hence, there's so much BS to which to respond. It's not hard.
Respond to the Forbes article, Adam. It's yet another fact in the piece of evidence that we can now call an empiric debate on the ACA.
Go ahead. I dare you.
At least Pogo will now call them Bad Capitalists, I bet.
Hey, that would be a cool name for a band. Bad Capitalists.
In which Ritmo inadvertently explains that crony capitalism is part of socialist fascism, yet can't quite make the connection himself.
So close!
You can pick a prize from the second shelf, but not the stuffed bears.
Whatever you say, bumper-sticker sloganeer.
You know, it's funny. In Israel they'd say that one solid criticism of Netanyahu was that he not only talks in sound-bites, but might in fact think in sound-bites.
Pogo definitely thinks in sound-bites.
Do let me know when that capitalist medical boutique practice of yours takes off, Pogie. April's quite taken with the concept. But I'm betting on you going the graybeard Kaczynski route and setting up your log-cabin practice in rural Idaho. You know, for the purity of it and all. Think of how capitalist it would be. Like bartering for chickens, as Sharon Angle explained. It would be the purest capitalism we would ever know. And someone as esteemed in the business as you would never have to stoop to learning from those physician leaders or executives. Nope, they're just not pure enough for you, Pogo.
Come on. I can see it now. Upon the portico of your log cabin office I will carve a caduceus, an equal sign (or scales) and a dollar sign. All your patients will love you. They will see you as the true naturalist, the rugged individualist. And they will never hesitate to help you build your empire in the woods, in exchange for treating the wounds they incur from regularly wrestling bears and whatnot.
You really have no idea what a douchebag you are, do you?
Oh well, at least I get to come up with funny stories to illustrate it.
If that makes you feel better, sure man, knock yourself out.
It certainly makes your sad existence and wacky priorities a lot funnier, so I will.
You really did miss your true calling in life. It was the job of writing those denial of service/coverage letters at the HMO in the 1990s and 2000s. You would have loved that much better than being an actual physician. Why do you even practice medicine?
You are either a fraud or represent an attitude no physician would be proud to openly declare.
Balls - you think in squirrel bytes.
I'd like to vist your planet sometime.
What's the weather like?
Is the cheese any good?
It's certainly better than taking account of your lack of any integrity and ability to believe and make propaganda out of things that much more powerful propagandists than you don't even believe.
Shift the subject, Pogo. Don't tell us about yourself. Pretend you're someone you're not. In the age of personalized medicine, the idea of revealing who you really are to these people who will now be empowered in their right to expect less bureaucratic hiding and shiftiness from you must really rankle.
Be honest. You resent the infirm and the poor. Tell the truth about it. Stop relying on ideological ignorance for once in your life and figure out some thoughts and feelings on your own, if you have any. Then get back to us.
On your planet, do random insults like that really work?
How fascinating!
How are the snacks there?
Awesome, I hope.
And the expectation for LESS bureaucracy under MugabeCare, is that the real expectation from you and yours?
If so, that's really quite funny.
Shit , I'm working on extra layers of bureaucracy for next year already.
I'm sure you'll enjoy it. It's for your own good, or so I'm told.
Run away from the question, Cowardly Pogo! Leading medicine with your hatred of leadership!
Forbes is socialist, sayeth the man who fears that opinions not his own are alien!
Talking with you is like talking to a ventriloquist. Not worth it. You can't answer for anything you say you believe in. What a small person you are. You know you can't stick up for what you spend so much energy fighting for and simply run away instead.
I wasn't aware you'd asked a question. Perhaps it was lost in the miasma of insults and strawmen.
Did it involve a word problem?
I was told there'd be no maff.
Was the answer 42?
Oh, another one.
Another question for Po po to avoid.
Why is it Mugabe that you seek to compare Obama to? What is it about him that brings about this comparison in your mind?
Do a lot of similarly ignorant Minnesotans know much about Robert Mugabe? What do they know about him, assuming they even recognize the name?
What made Mugabe a better comparison than any other name you could have put in there?
Do let me know when your ventriloquist has figured out how to evade any answers to those questions.
You have the integrity of a hyena.
Three guesses.
Clue. Begins with "s" and "f".
Yes, you certainly are worth insulting. That's what happens to adults who evade direct questions, despite proclaiming themselves as being in positions of authority to speak to particular issues, warrant.
That's what happens to people who think capitalism is a cover for their being anti-social.
But it doesn't mean you can't answer a direct question. Unless, of course, your integrity simply is that weak.
What about the snacks on your planet?
What, they're no good?
Mostly involve variants of Cheeze-Whiz?
Well that sucks.
I can understand your constant anger.
It's been fun, dude. Time for your random answer generator to recharge for the night.
More evasion from a professional pussy.
Tell us your real name, Pogo. Reveal something brave behind your awesome anonymity. Give anyone here a reason to not doubt your integrity.
Or just leave it to your ventriloquist personality and make stupid jokes, that no one's laughing at.
You have the maturity of a two-year old. Good to know you're taken about as seriously as one.
Make sure to let the other physicians know how inadequate their professional integrity is compared to yours. Make sure to let them know about the loyalty and ideology test you'll soon be subjecting them to, also.
Good night, John-boy.
Forget OWS. We need OPS - Occupy Public Space.
Ritmo?
R & B aka Ritmo sez ...
Tell us your real name, Pogo. Reveal something brave behind your awesome anonymity.
Yeah...just like you do Ritmo with your vacant Blogger profile. Be brave like that, eh?
You almost sound like ole "Iron Fist" at LGF, what with the "pussy" ad hominems and challenges of "brave" etc.
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