As Bat brought to our attention, there are equal volumes of ethanol in a serving of spirits, wines, and beers, but are spirits harder on the body than beer or wine if you imbibe the same amount of drinks?
If one wanted a very chilled martini, could dry ice be used in a safe way (in a sealed container)?
Is it okay to make a martini without vermouth?
66 comments:
No.
How about a refrigerated martini glass?
I need a drink.
Please do not taunt the involuntary teetotaler.
It's cruel.
I will defer to chick on the dry ice. However, I drink my martinis w/o vermouth w/ one exception. Once in awhile a GOOD bar will have a vermouth mister. Just give the chilled glass a quick mist of vermouth. Perfection!
Sorry, ST. Hang in there, babe.
I have read that it is sufficient for one to wave one's martini in the general direction of Italy to compensate for the absence of vermouth.
ST, We have some folks over for dinner tonight, making BBQ brisket. The guy and myself love Negroni's. An acquired taste. Campari and gin. I am ol' fashioned, I have tried all gins, Beefeater is my fav.
ST, I apologize dude!! I didn't read past "I need drink."
Deborah, LOL!
I don't think I'll ever again experience the great spiritual journey of my youth.
Well, and middle ages, too.
It's not a martini, it's gin.
Joe told me this not 3 days ago.
I have no idea what vermouth tastes like by itself. Maybe I'll try it some time. But I go through it like crazy. I just bought a bottle last week and it's already half gone. The bottle shop has two sizes, and this is the big size.
You know what? I think I'll buy a box of white wine and try that for cooking. My problem is the wine going off before it is used. The box might be an answer for that. I'll try a small box. And possibly re-use the bladder inside by refilling with a bottle of regular wine when the the box runs out.
Everything is better with wine. Trufax. Even for blokes such as myself who cannot stand the shit on its own. I keep trying too, and I'm all, what do I got, internal Antabuse or f'k'n what?
For you see, *hand akimbo* all through human history sugary fruits self-fermented. Humans ate the turned fruits anyway. Grapes begin fermenting right in the basket by being crushed by their own weight, the yeast on the surface contacts the juice, and BANG there you go, even before the pickers return to the winery. If you consume these fruit you will feel the affects of consuming fermented beverage. And so it was all through history, mankind and womenfolk limited to the fermented fruits and grain. A check, as it were, on drunkenness. There is only so much they can drink. Even so, in Roman times anyone who drank their wine straight without diluting with water was considered an unseemly hard drinking undisciplined sot. There would be whispers, "He doesn't even dilute his wine." Gasp. What a cad.
Until that fateful day distillation was discovered.
Records show in the Greece in the first century with China concurrently. Great perverse minds do think alike.
But that was scientific distillation, not the distillation of first wine then beer, then other things too, concentrating the alcohol content, and from the time the practice became widespread in the 12th century, all bets are off. Goodbye natural brake to incorrigible indolence.
I'm not saying people didn't get drunk before distillation, they certainly did, but it was not so serious a problem that 80 + proof led to. Lives were ruined by alcohol even back then, but not to the extent that happens today.
I wish I could drink wine.
Even though I cannot drink it, I have all kind of alcohol around here. I am very well stocked. Enviably stocked. It's all good stuff too, no crap stuff allowed.
Lately I have been drinking beer and it helped me gain weight. I went from 135 to 143, that's like what, 8 pounds? But my pants size hasn't changed. And my belt loops are the same.
As far as Beefeater, Tangueray, etc., it would be interesting to do a taste test.
I gotta have a serious date if I'm gonna go hard likker.
ST, that is what it is all about, continuing-the-species-wise.
Chip, I'm sure you've thought of this, but could it be sulfites in the wines you've had?
Serious date??? You're in a relationship. So I guess wine is fine :)
Part of the recipe of a martini is putting the gin over ice. So you are diluting it when you do that. You could drink really cold gin or vodka without any water or vermouth being added, but then it would be a drink of cold vodka or gin (possibly) with a garnish. Which would be okay (albeit a bit harsh), but it is no longer a martini.
Of course it is all a matter of degree. Vodka and gin are not straight alcohol, they are both mixed with water.
As for gins, I tried Bloom recently and it was very good (for a martini, not a negroni since the campari would overwhelm it). It is an English boutique brand with some orange taste but not terribly expensive. I do like Hendrick's if you are doing the cuke garnish . I would not make a negroni with it.
Doesn't everyone keep the gin in the freezer?
Deborah, Beefeater is very juniper. I had juniper trees around the house here I grew up. It gives gin that distinctive aroma. Smells have a strong connection to memory.
Yes, Nick, odors connect directly to the brain via the olfactory nerve. More than anything it takes you back.
ChipS, I want it to STAY cold.
Thanks for the lesson, EBL. I'll remember Bloom, try to get it sometime.
While I do follow recipes, I do keep vodka (strega, sambuca, and lemoncello) in the freezer. But not gin. Okay I do not drink that much gin…but now you have me thinking.
This post over at AoSHQ has a Chicken Little chemistry quality to it…
ChipS, I want it to STAY cold.
Drink faster.
Many bartenders say keeping vodka cold screws up classic recipes, but I have made many a martini by putting cold vodka in a shaker with some ice and a splash of olive jar juice and then strain into a martin glass. No shaking or stirring, just the pour for mix. I might occasionally add a drop of vermouth (at most).
Those martinis are strong but they taste good.
lol ChipS, problem solved.
EBL, your link 404'd.
As far as martinis, I asked about the vermouth because it seems to me that olive juice may be more important to the taste. I'll have to get a shaker and get fancy, but I'll say 'poured, not shaken.'
deborah said...
As far as Beefeater, Tangueray, etc., it would be interesting to do a taste test.
We did a blind taste test of affordable gins and Gordon's won.
I like Death's Door gin.
Deb, most of the cocktails I mix are citrus-based. I don't have any vermouth at the moment. But every bar should have some white Lillet. It goes great w/ gin.
Oh and the glasses are always in the freezer. The gin is in the fridge but gets shaken over ice before with the other ingredienst.
I've often thought that people who drink screw drivers, bloody marys, etc., have a leg up health-wise on other drinkers.
Gin in fridge, glasses in freezer, check :) Thanks.
@Deborah: I updated faking bad.
I've been working hard to get wine, pilsners, ales, and martinis in the mix. It's an art and a science.
You have a great collection worked up. I love Cody's idea of youtubes pranking people. I volunteer to use the purple ice pop one on someone's light tan carpet...she would freak :)
And what would work on a tan bucket seat?? How about a McDonald's ketchup packet burst open?
Wow, this is a topic I kind of asked for -- great!
I have several things to say:
1. Drink what you like, but a martini has some vermouth, even a little. I prefer to swirl it in the frozen glass, then dump the excess. Sort of like the mister I guess.
2. Freezing liquor works great for being cold, but a martini really ends some dilution, which is frustrated by the freezing. So you have to shake more, which undoes the benefit of freezing.
3. The idea of putting dry ice in the drink occurred to me too, after shaking. Did someone explain why that's bad? I missed that. Who said it, above? I recall some hip bars were using nitrogen with drinks. If nitro, why not dry ice?
4. The nearest-possible-to-perfection martini, to my taste, is vodka, swirl of vermouth, blue cheese stuffed olives, extremely cold. I like vodka with some bite, not that expensive stuff that's too smooth. I use Stoli.
5. I have a theory on why the perfect martini (at least for me) is unobtainable. Ask and I'll explain. Or you could guess why. It's very thinky but no one has disputed it. Can you guess my theory?
ST:
St Thomas said some things about how all good things are related to the goodness of God. Which means the enjoyment of any good is an anticipation of the supreme goodness of heaven.
Which means, heaven is like all that's good about a really good drink, but none of the bad parts; only it's more than just a drink of course.
Martin, great ideas. I must try the blue cheese stuffed olive martini.
You wouldn't want to use the dry ice in the drink...you'd burn your skin if it came in contact, and I suspect your drink would instanteously evaporate.
I won't guess, go ahead and tell.
You wouldn't want to use the dry ice in the drink...you'd burn your skin if it came in contact, and I suspect your drink would instanteously evaporate.
Dry ice can "burn" but I used to handle the stuff and it won't instantly burn. Like a firewalker, you can touch the stuff briefly -- enough to lob a chunk into water. The "fog" it creates is really condensed moisture from the atmosphere. If you had a perfectly dry environment -- like a desert, you would never "see" the fog effect.
Can you guess my theory?
It would destroy the allure. Who seeks perfection once it is obtained?
Padre, Is your question existential? I would like to know the answer. But, I violated my 2 drink rule last night and had 3 Negronis. I'm not thinking on this day of rest. I did forget to mention the swirling of vermouth and then dumping. I bartended @ an Italian restaurant that was just a few blocks from a funeral home. We would have post funeral groups come in for drinks and a meal. I got to know the funeral director well. He taught me the swirl. This was one of the nicest customers I ever met. When he came in for dinner w/ his wife, she would only allow him 2 martinis. He could handle 3 w/o a problem, he was a big man. So, I suggested that he excuse himself to the bathroom, shortly after being seated in the dining room, and I would have that 3rd martini waiting for him. It was like I unshackled this nice man from bondage. He went from being a good tipper to a GREAT tipper. I was always moved how well this man was w/ grieving people. But, I was also impressed w/ how he had a great rapport w/ clergy of all faiths.
When my Dad and mom died I had to make the arrangements. I had gone to Catholic high school w/ a kid whose family owned the local funeral home. He used to crack us up w/ dead body jokes. But, when it came time to make arrangements I can't tell you how great it was to have an old friend help w/ the arrangements. This martini funeral director was like an old friend to everyone.
On this topic, the movie Bernie is a great flick about a rather iconoclastic funeral director.
I had a friend who walked the South Jersey beaches selling ice cream. TOUGH work but good money. He could handle dry ice, but you can't linger. It's like chefs being able to handle hot stuff. My brother would amaze me w/ the ability to handle hot pans sans mitts.
Thanks for the info, chick, I apologize for my ignorance. What would happen if you put an ice-cube sized piece of dry ice in a martini?
Great story, Nick, sounds like a hell of a nice guy.
What would happen if you put an ice-cube sized piece of dry ice in a martini?
I'm forgetting the temperature of dry ice and the freezing point of vodka or gin, but my guess is that dry ice could make a nice gin slushy. It will certainly make it more viscous. Have you ever noticed that gin in the freezer pours a bit more like anti-freeze than water? That's viscosity.
It will make a a very Dr. Jekyll looking fog too. I used to do that around the neighborhood for kids at Halloween. I'd lob a chunk of dry ice into a beaker of green water. The best part was when I'd take a sip and pretend to change moods.
We used to make dry ice acetone slush baths in the lab by pouring pure acetone into a dog dish shaped thermos and then adding enough dry ice to make a slush but not enough to freeze the liquid. We did the same with 95% alcohol but preferred acetone because it was cheaper.
lol I'd love to see vid of you as Mr. Hyde.
Neat about the acetone bath. What was it used for?
And that brings us to the topic of freezer slush drinks. Any good recipes, peeps?
Chick got the right answer. Here's my theory, developed over many martinis (over a reasonable number of occasions):
The perfection of a martini is a function both of objective criteria -- the ideal ingredients, temperature, admixture, etc. -- but also a critical subjective element: what I deem most tasty or satisfying or otherwise epitomal (is that a word?) at that moment. Because that subjective element can shift for not always clear reasons, the goal line to be reached can move unpredictably.
And that creates the occasion for a further phenomenon: the mind of the one passionately pursuing the "perfect" martini will unconsciously draw back from the goal. I think this could happen for one or both of two reasons.
First, the one pursuing perfection will fashion, in his mind, a goal that cannot be attained -- a Platonic ideal of The Martini. So perfectly cold, so piquant, so brisk, so...everything. It's like the "perfect" priest who is fresh and young with 20 years experience. That perfection-pursuer will be so very disappointed with the actual, this-world, "perfect" drink.
Second, as Chick pointed out, the quest then ends. Now all one can do is aim to repeat. There is no surpassing. One might as well give up martinis and work on Old fashioneds or gimlets. And that is sad. It's more fun to continue the quest.
Chick, Deborah: it seems to me a smaller bit of dry ice would simply bring the temp lower without making it too viscous, as the temps of the two elements converge. And a tongs avoids any burns. One could just let the dry ice dissolve before sipping. Or, rather decadently, one could linger over the drink -- so achingly close to perfection, ahh! -- and add more dry ice, as needed, to keep the drink bracingly cold. The appeal of the dry ice, of course, being that it won't dilute the oh-so-close-to-perfect ratios!
Here is a much more pedestrian method, what do you think?
Shake the martini as usual, with frozen liquor, to the proper dilution (I.e., you shake it a bit longer than with warmer liquor), then strain out the ice, then...
Back into the deep freeze. Now it's both properly mixed, and chilled to Artic coldness.
What to do while you wait? Why, drink the martini you prepared hours ago!
Oh and the blue cheese olives? Don't use those soaked in oil. Best if you stuff them yourself, which is a pain.
I hope that's not a gin martini that you're shaking, padre.
Yes, stuffing olives with cream cheese is a pain, but blue cheese even more so. But I will soldier on, preferably at a MEET-UP.
I think you nailed it: the exact same perfect martini will be better or not depending on your current MOOD.
"Chick, Deborah: it seems to me a smaller bit of dry ice would simply bring the temp lower without making it too viscous, as the temps of the two elements converge. And a tongs avoids any burns. One could just let the dry ice dissolve before sipping. Or, rather decadently, one could linger over the drink -- so achingly close to perfection, ahh! -- and add more dry ice, as needed, to keep the drink bracingly cold. The appeal of the dry ice, of course, being that it won't dilute the oh-so-close-to-perfect ratios!"
A hedonist priest? Buyer beware :) I spend a lot of time in Ohio. I may stop by for a much-needed confession. Or you could hand me off to another. Either way. (Not for reconciliation purposes.)
ChipS, if you paid attention you'd know it's Vodka...Stoli.
Confession, I was at a restaurant and ordered a martini which came in a cool metal martini glass. It was not till I got the check I realized it was vodka :( :(
I'm telling you, those olives lend something.
deborah, it's a question of sets vs subsets.
An olive destroys the purity of a martini. Twist of lemon is correct.
Or, w. Hendrick's, a cucumber slice.
"An olive destroys the purity of a martini. Twist of lemon is correct."
Talk about subjectivity. What does the earliest martini recipe say?
'Sides, I have the ultimate solution: Scotch rocks.
Talk about subjectivity.
This is hilarious in the context of this thread.
Chip:
I've tried martinis with regular olives, with onions, with lemon peel, and blue cheese olives, and the latter suits me best. (Shrug.) A twist of lemon or regular olives are adequate. I detest anything that "dirties" my martini.
As far as gin v. vodka, I like a gin martini just fine, but it requires, for my taste, a bit more vermouth; and I just prefer the "bite" of vodka.
Deborah:
No, heavens, not a "hedonist" priest! A Thomistic one. All good things can be enjoyed with suitable moderation.
Which reminds me of a witticism, which I offer only for humor, not as any sort of rule:
One martini is enough;
two martinis are two many;
and three martinis aren't enough.
Maybe Dorothy Parker said it?
To defend my non-hedonism, I would also counter that if something's worth doing, it's worth doing well. I.e., why mess around: make that martini cold!
Only Commies and women drink vodka martinis.
I heard the maxim, martinis are like breasts; one is not enough and three are too many. However, I would be happy to titty..wait the Padre is here. Never mind.
My father-in-law was a great guy. Flew many bombing missions over Germany. Never spoke about it unless you asked him after he had a couple martinis. And, he LOVED both kind. When I made them, or when he was in a bar and asked if he wanted vodka or gin, he would just say, "Surprise me." I like anchovy olives in my Beefeater martini.
Blue Cheese olives are second on my list. Dirty martinis would be a felony if I were governor.
Chip:
"I think I'll buy a box of white wine and try that for cooking."
Gross. Even I have my standards :)
Martin, you're just so into it ;) j/k
I know people of the cloth (I have a nun aunt) are held to standards that perhaps they shouldn't be. When she switched to regular garb a priest told her, 'you've lost something, Sister' which hurt her feelings. Whereas my uncle priest in the Seventies was wearing secular clothes and riding around in fancy cars. Definitely sexist bullshit.
Nick:
" I like anchovy olives in my Beefeater martini."
Awesome.
I vote the first MEET-UP be in Madison. Please please please please. We'll have Inga; all is forgiven.
ndspinelli said...
Only Commies and women drink vodka martinis.
I can prove I am neither.
I am itching to try anchovy olives. However, that may prove to violate one of my rules:
Two good things aren't necessarily good together.
Gotta say that, despite his regrettable predilection for vodka martinis, Fr. Fox's writing on alcohol consumption is far more pleasant to read than Fr. Andrew Greeley's.
Box wine is fine. Some of it is actually pretty good wine itself, and the packaging is well designed both for convenience and for keeping it fresher, longer.
Chip:
Haha! I am no great fan of the late Father Greeley (RIP), so I appreciate winning the comparison.
Fr. Fox, from one overheard conversation I got the impression that Fr. Greeley was a good storyteller.
He was telling someone that a nephew was going to study economics at the Univ. of Chicago, and added: "We don't know how to feel about that. There's never been a Republican in the family before."
Yes, I confess to being a total eavesdropper in coffee shops.
Chip:
Oh, he probably was a good storyteller. I just wish he'd been more concerned to uphold and defend Catholic teaching.
Deborah, I would love a convention here, or anywhere. Inga, now Annie, is imploding on the Turley blog. This will be 0 for 4 w/ blogs for our crazy, angry, lying LPN w/ a master's degree in nursing from Marquette.
Greeley was 80% politician and 20% cleric.
I'm certainly no authority on Catholicism, or Andrew Greeley, but it seems to me that he saw himself as representing Catholics to the rest of the world.
The only things I know about him are that he wrote trashy novels and--if there is such a thing--respectable sociology. I think he may have been the first scholar to point out that Catholics were among the most highly educated religious groups in the US.
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