Saturday, July 9, 2016

Was Philando Castile an arm robbery suspect?


108 comments:

edutcher said...

AFAIK, that's partially incorrect. He matched a BOLO alert for an armed robbery only a few blocks from where their car was pulled over. Whether he was the one has yet to be determined.

It should be known he did not have a CCP for the gun in the car. And he had a long history of being pulled over.

My own guess is it will come out he was another SOB (son of Barry), like Alton Sterling.

Funny how, once the facts are known, all these riots are over career thugs in the process of getting some long overdue justice.

ricpic said...

"Why Philando jump from woman to woman like dat?"

"Why you name him Philando?"

Rhythm and Balls said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Lem said...

It puts the policemans actions in a different light. The video is conveniently missing the part that lead up to the shooting. So I can't make a conclusive Monday morning quaterback determination

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...
Funny how, once the facts are known, all these riots are over career thugs in the process of getting some long overdue justice.

Actually, no. Gunning someone down while they're complying with your requests is no "justice


Well, since justice is an unknown concept in the Obamanation and, since every one of these "incidents" that becomes an excuse to riot and murder have turned out to have been based on lies about a professional thug (SOB (son of Barry), Gentle Giant, Freddie Gray, Alton Sterling, and now this sterling citizen) does turn out to be justice.

And we don't know all that transpired, now, do we? We had to wait for the autopsy on Freddie Gray, we had to see all the tape on the Gentle Giant, and I'm betting there's plenty we haven't seen in this.

Ritmo loves playing the Lefty gadfly and always ends up wrong.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Why didn't Dayton state any of this?

Rhythm and Balls said...

The guy who always gets it wrong is the guy who wants a police state as ed does. White people are never wrongly treated, convicted, executed in America. Everything bad that happened to ed in his life is because he "had it coming." Justice, and all that.

edutcher said...

Somehow, I seem to remember Ritmo pulling the same sophistries when the Gentle Giant and the SOB were in the news.

I'm just waiting for all the evidence, as experience has shown we never get the full story up front and it's Ritmo (pay attention here, April) who tosses up the straw man of wanting a police state.

Ritmo seems to suspect any cop involved in the death of a black felon to be the guilty party.

I'll wait till we find out more (as I said earlier, it hasn't been established he's the armed robber), but, for right now, it don't look good for the Philanderer.

Trooper York said...

Actually more white people are killed by the cops than black people. White people are wrongly convicted all the time. Justice is more of a class thing than a race thing. Or at least just as much as a class thing. You ever watch Cops? Every scene has some trailer park dude running away from the cops and hiding under a kiddie pool in the backyard.

BLM is a political smokescreen. It is the way for the poverty pimps to hide the fact that black on black crime is the real problem. They never ever address that. Look at Chicago. Look at what Balitmore has become.

Vox Day has an interesting paragraph in one of his recent posts:
Now, as for the binary-thinking idiots who think if you don't support the cops means you are a murderous BLM-supporting Black Panther, let me explain something to you. Nothing the police do - nothing - is going to turn America's blacks into whites. They cannot keep a nonexistent peace. History clearly teaches there are four ways to permanently resolve the current situation: amalgamation, segregation, deportation, and elimination.

Which of those do you support? If you don't support one of them, you're not serious and your opinion doesn't count. Yes, they're all terrible options. Yes, they're all ugly and awful and horrific. So is history.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'm betting there's plenty we haven't seen in this.

Oh. Have I been rioting? And why doesn't your Breitbart piece cite/source anything?

In the age of the cell phone you'd better get things right as quickly as you can. You'd better thank your lucky stars that police cams are going to become standard issue if that's what's needed to quickly retaliate against a video as incriminating as what Diamond Reynolds live streamed. And again, why was none of this mentioned at the conference the other day?

The constitution mentions a number of rights for the accused, none for the government - of which the cops are just foot soldiers of one branch (executive, maybe you didn't know that). They have a right to do their jobs as effectively as the constitution allows, but don't be surprised if most human beings and Americans think of justice as something a little more civilized than you do.

Trooper York said...

Vox is one of the more articulate voices of the alt-right. He is widely condemned as a racist by SJW and the virtue signalers of the conservative establishment. I notice even a so called iconoclast and "truth teller" like the Ace of Spades is banning commenters who don't toe the line. The events of this election and the final days of the horrendous hideous failure that is the Obama administration is exposing the fatal flaws of so called conservatives.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Actually more white people are killed by the cops than black people.

I know, that was my point. (And don't forget all the wrongful killing the government does). When ed wants to celebrate quick actions as "justice", he will get carried away and it will backfire indiscriminately. Maybe what the cop did was right, even heroic. But I think the word "justice" has a different meaning than he does. That's why whites are joining these movements.

Cops do a very dangerous job for which we should be very thankful. But there's a line here.

Yes, they're all ugly and awful and horrific. So is history.

History shows that America's history is a better and more odds-defying and perfectible history than anyone else's. It's just that we put up with a lot of aggravation to get there. But we also avoid a lot of even worse stuff.

Trooper York said...

I have said it many times and I will say it again. Obama is David Dinkins writ large. The same affirmative action premises that brought the first ultra-liberal black mayor brought the same things with the first ultra-liberal black President.

Dinkens gave us Crown Heights were blacks murdered Jews in the streets whipped on by Al Sharpton calling them blood suckers and diamond merchants.

Obama gave us the riots in Ferguson, in Baltimore, the murders of the NYPD patrolmen and now the massacre in Dallas. Now Obama is a lot smoother than the Reverend Al. The media smooths it out for him. But it is the same deal. History repeats itself.

Which we can only hope will continue. Giuliani replaced Dinkins. Trump will replace Obama. I don't think America will put Hillary with all her problems in. They won't say it out loud. But just as many liberal whites pulled the lever for Giuliani they will do the same for Trump.

edutcher said...

A lot of people who call themselves Conservatives ain't. Libertarians among them.

They do want to reach the Republican base, so they try to snow people they're the voice of Conservatism. Witness Driscoll at Insta.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'm betting there's plenty we haven't seen in this.

Oh. Have I been rioting? And why doesn't your Breitbart piece cite/source anything?

In the age of the cell phone you'd better get things right as quickly as you can. You'd better thank your lucky stars that police cams are going to become standard issue if that's what's needed to quickly retaliate against a video as incriminating as what Diamond Reynolds live streamed. And again, why was none of this mentioned at the conference the other day?


Some babe who can't decide if her name is Lavish or Diamond is the sole source of info?

There are witnesses. There are cameras in the cop cars. Maybe even a body cam. Maybe somebody else has a vid. We do know from the Last Refuge piece, the gun is visible. Like the Gentle Giant or Freddie Gray, this one will surely go into extra innings.

We have yet to see all the evidence. Like his pal, April, Ritmo only spouts what fits his ideas.

PS Having done all he could to divide the country, President Pissy now faces some tough questions about it and suddenly we're not as divided.

Trooper York said...

Actually we don't avoid it Ritmo. It is there if you look.

What we did to the American Indian is exactly what we are talking about. We destroyed them root and branch. When we were faced with an existential threat after Pearl Harbor we rounded up the Japs and put them in camps. When public disorder and secession destroyed our more perfect union the great and noble President Lincoln suspended habeas corpus and shut down newspapers that didn't toe the line. It can happen here. It will happen here to one degree or another.

It is indeed a slippery slope when you tolerate this kind of stuff. We have to decide when we are skiing down this slippery slope do we want to be Jean-Claude Killey or Sonny Bono.

Rhythm and Balls said...

...tosses up the straw man of wanting a police state.

You're the one who used the word "justice" as applicable to killings outside of a court of law.

Ritmo seems to suspect any cop involved in the death of a black felon to be the guilty party.

I don't eve pay attention to these things. I just saw the Reynolds video last night. It was pretty horrifying and damning.

So just go ahead and get your videos straight. These things will happen more and more, and in the war of video against video, again, go and get your videos out quick. Behave on them. Get the MN governor to be more honest and less political.

...SOB...

What is there that's even worth mentioning here? Does your bs ever end? In a legal setting in which deadly force become the default presumption over self-defense by any means necessary, you're simply going to have more killings whose justifications won't be as obvious. That's a horrible thing. The cops agree. But why bother with all that when you can insult Obama some more and use vulgarities.

Trooper York said...

Vox Day has long spoken about the militarization of the police as have many other on the alt-right. We should be concerned. Because the might of the police will not be turned on to the criminals who prey on their own kind. That is too difficult. It will be turned on law abiding citizens. They will be taking your guns. Arresting people who say the wrong thing on the Internet. It will be put at the beck and call of the ultra-liberal social justice warriors.

Who was taken at gunpoint and force-ably deported with the full throated support of the entire media and most of Congress? An illegal alien who murdered an American Citizen? A Mexican rapist? A dangerous radical Islamist who is riling up native morons to shoot up discos? Who did they deport under the barrel of a gun?

Elia Gonazlez.

He had to be returned to a Communist Country. Nobody else. Who did that. Bill Clinton.

If you don't think the security forces will do the biding of the SJW's and the politically correct ultra-liberals than you are sadly mistaken.

Rhythm and Balls said...

What we did to the American Indian is exactly what we are talking about. We destroyed them root and branch.

We still are nowadays. It's just that not everyone finds breaking treaties and taking land to be as noble as you apparently do. I guess this is the election of indecency. Trump's a douchebag, handing out smallpox-laced blankets is a great thing to do. (Most Indians died of disease anyway way before the U.S. was established). But great deal on throwing just another enemy out there - the ones with first claims to right of the land and who kept more than a few settlers alive. I guess these lists never end.

When we were faced with an existential threat after Pearl Harbor we rounded up the Japs and put them in camps. When public disorder and secession destroyed our more perfect union the great and noble President Lincoln suspended habeas corpus and shut down newspapers that didn't toe the line.

Roosevelt and Lincoln were operating in either a legal or semi-novel framework that still eventually allowed the courts to come in and redirect them once breaches were obvious.

It can happen here. It will happen here to one degree or another.

No it won't.

You're dreaming.

There has always been vigilante/police/gangster violence in America and that's just the way it is and always will be thanks to the NRA. Scalia famously said we were a "violent" country. He's your star justice. That's the way it is. We were no less violent when your parents were celebrating white outlaws in the wild west than we are now with black outlaws. That's the kind of country you want to have, and the fact that the constitution ensures that they still have rights until arrested and/or convicted is just an even bigger part of the bargain that you can't overturn just because you don't like the skin color of these outlaws and alleged outlaws. Sorry, Charlie. Trump's selling another big marquee with phony gold lame underneath. The emperor has no clothes.

Rhythm and Balls said...

He had to be returned to a Communist Country. Nobody else. Who did that. Bill Clinton.

Bill Clinton followed the law. Oh no! Obama did more for the kid than any Republican by simply opening them to us as the old dictator dies. Again, not as dramatic as a political move (or a war - the ultimate political move), but this republic still has laws to abide by. It did even when Washington was quelling your vaunted Kentucky hillbillies.

If you don't think the security forces will do the biding of the SJW's and the politically correct ultra-liberals than you are sadly mistaken.

LOL. They already are. Body cams! Here come the body cams!

Community policing is more effective, anyway. I understand if it gets your blood going to see the cops as being involved in a perpetual struggle against the community, but that way just doesn't work as well. We want cohesive, effective policing. Not violence just for the sake of lionizing another cop or alleged criminal - as fun and dramatic as that sounds and as heroic as one of them may have been.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Civilization is coming. Hallelujah!

Trooper York said...

I support the police. More than most here. I am fully aware of the problems of their laziness, cupidity and stupidity. Trust me. I have dealt with it all my life.

But the problem is not really the police. They are much more professional than the sixties as I recall. In those days they had the "Pad." They would collect payoffs from the stores and the criminals as well. The grocery store and the bookie joint. They don't do that kind of stuff. They are also not walking the beat the way they used to. Where they got know people and who were the problems that needed to be rousted. That was what they tried to bring back with community policing and stop and frisk. The law abiding black families are totally in favor of that. Of course the SJW's and the press have attacked that and forced police forces across the country to end those programs. Thus you get Balitmore.

The problem is the people being policed. They have to change. You know that is not going to happen. So we know the choices.

Amalgamation, segregation, deportation, or elimination.


edutcher said...

A tale of 2 campaigns.

Trump says, “A brutal attack on our police force is an attack on our country, and an attack on our families. We must stand in solidarity with law enforcement, which we must remember is the force between civilization and total chaos. Every American has the right to live in safety and peace.”

President Pissy has NO IDEA why racist Black Power activist Micah Johnson gunned down five police officers at a Dallas Black Lives matter protest.

Rhythm and Balls said...

But the problem is not really the police.

Maybe not.

But there are still lines to be aware of and without community trust, they are back to the bad old days.

Amalgamation, segregation, deportation, or elimination.

Sounds like a fun, buzzy motto. Will the DB-in-Chief use it? Not sure what it means, let alone alone how segregation will be re-constitutionalized or applicability to naturalized citizens. But it as far as rallying purposes go, I could see it on a banner. Or something.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'll leave it at this (unless more to discuss comes up).

The big problem is cultural and educational.

Black Americans simply don't think it's "cool" to pick up a book, learn some of the basic sophistication in gaining credibility in an advanced society, and reap the rewards of that.

In other countries they speak with educated accents. British commonwealth countries. I doubt there's as many problems.

But until that changes, they're simply not going to do as easily in any legal or culturally privileged setting as some dark-skinned Dravidian guy. That's a fact.

As for the Spanish, I don't know what to tell you.

I think a lot of that stuff is overblown, though. Massively.

But the guy needed a new market. He's got it.

The War against Illegal Immigration Market.

I hope he sells a million off it. Or a billion.

Six of one half dozen of the other.

Trooper York said...

You are not arguing with me Ritmo. You are agreeing with me.

I am not praising what happened with the American Indian. I am just telling you what history shows us. To burst you phony premise that somehow America is better or that it won't happen here.

All of the alternatives that Vox Day has historical precedents.

Amalgamation is the most benign. That happened with the Irish and the Italians and more interestingly with the Chinese. They amalgamated with the dominant culture. Not without bumps and bruises. Some more that others. Some had an easier pathway than others.

Segregation was slightly more problematic. Segregation is a natural human response. We like like to be with our own kind. As long as it is organic and voluntary and not enforced under the color of law it can be quite effective. We are trending that way. Not by public policy. But by fact. By people moving to gated communities of one sort or another. There is an element of class in this as well.

Deportation is what Trump is selling. He wants to deport some of the criminal/terrorist element that Obama and Clinton are desperate to import to our society. They want to do that for political advantage. Trump is the reaction to that.

Elimination is happening before our very eyes. ISIS is doing it to Christians and other religious minorities. It has happened many times before. Hutu and Tutsi. The breakup of Yugoslavia. The Holocaust. Not an option in America. I hope.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Ok I'm off to get some sun. Hope this thing goes the way you want.

But it sounds to me like a tragedy any way you slice it.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'm sure there's more we agree on than it seems. But I don't think America is "better" or that reality doesn't apply. I just think it has a better shot at getting things to work out better than people give it credit for. Perfectible, not perfect.

Maybe I'm naive.

I think it will be amalgamation. It will just take a long, long time.

Trooper York said...

Enjoy the sun. I am stuck inside as usual. I envy you.

One thing I know for sure. It is not going to go the way I want it to go. It never does.

Trooper York said...

I think it will be segregation. Sooner rather than later. Organically. In fact Obama feels the same way. That is why he is pushing disparate impact. If that is the battlefield it will get bloody. Real quick.

AJ Lynch said...

From what I can tell, in both incidents, the cops seem to have way over-reacted. And, until I see more evidence that changes my opinion, neither man deserved to die. That does not mean the cops are racists though.

But I believe BLM is a no good instigating racist group itself - and no amount of additional evidence can convince me otherwise.

And Obama tossed gasoline on BLM's racist fire with his lame lying comments the day the two black men's deaths hit the news.

Rabel said...

1. The St. Anthony police could clarify several things, but they have remained mostly silent so far. This isn't helping.

2. Lem's link is to a Charles C. Johnson associated site. Any evaluation of its contents should be made with that in mind.

3. I am impressed with the armed robber's sense of color coordination. Feel the teal.

Chip Ahoy said...

I dated a woman at CU-Denver who learned skiing the Jean-Claude Killy method. She did well. For a bunny hopping down the hill. She stayed upright, and her skis parallel with weight on the downhill ski, then turn, hop, skip hop, ski, hop, ski, hop, ski hop, all the way down the hill cute as can be. She was limited to blue square runs. Her feminine graceful artful overly careful delicate form could not manage any black diamond run.

Between her and Toni I concluded women ski to pretend they're being athletic. To spend money and be chic, have a trip. As riding a chair up the slope and having a picnic in the sun is athletic. They both wore me out being resolutely un-athletic unadventurous unchallenged all day. I honestly could not see the point in both of them even trying. Both WAY too careful. This over the course of several trips with both of them. We kept trying. Until it became clear. I lost patience with an effort than can go nowhere and with no payoff in fun. Now, you don't do that, discourage people from trying, but if you saw both these two women on the slope then you'd agree, just get off the slope already and stay off. Go have hot toddy instead.

Lem said...

This guy pokes a hole on the theory that Philando could not possibly shoot with a gun in his pocket.

https://twitter.com/JaredWyand/status/751859225186402308

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...

He had to be returned to a Communist Country. Nobody else. Who did that. Bill Clinton.

Bill Clinton followed the law


The Hell he did. Last I looked, we gave asylum to political refugees.

Rabel said...

1. The St. Anthony police could clarify several things, but they have remained mostly silent so far. This isn't helping.

Same with the Gentle Giant and Freddie Gray. Get all the facts first.

2. Lem's link is to a Charles C. Johnson associated site. Any evaluation of its contents should be made with that in mind.

If you mean Last Refuge, they don't foam at the mouth like LGF. In fact, they document their stuff pretty well. IIRC, they're the ones who broke the half mil gift by the One True Ted to the Fiorina campaign and the gifts from McConnell's PACs to the One True Ted.

Trooper York said...

If the cops did anything wrong or are at fault they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Most people agree with that.

The problem is that Black Lives Matters want the cops to be prosecuted regardless of the facts of the case. That's what they wanted in Ferguson. In Baltimore. Every cop is a criminal and all the sinners saints.

In facts Black Lives Matter do not want criminals to be prosecuted. If a skell is pointing a gun at the cops they want them to be shot in the arm like a 1950's TV Western. They live in a fantasy world. Reinforced by the President and the Media.

They will keep pushing. They will not like the push back.

Lem said...

If you see where the decedent appears to be bleeding from, it appears that the policemen was in such a proximity that one could reasonably speculate that something spooked him. Some kind of a motion on the part of Philando.

Trooper York said...

Ed is right on the money when he said that this is 1968 redux.

The only thing is there were assassinations in 1968. Kennedy. Martin Luther King.

We just have to hope and pray that history does not repeat itself in that way.

But violence is in the air.

edutcher said...

OK, looks like Here's the story.

Castile was being sought for the robbery.

Minnesota Police Officer Jeronimo Yanez is now telling his side of the story.
Matt Finn at FOX News reported:

“Yanez’s attorney says not only did the officer react to the presence of a gun, he tells us that Castile that day failed to comply with a “do not move” order. Officer Yanez ultimately told Castile “do not move” and that he failed to comply with that order and that there was apparently a visible gun. We also went back and looked at the Facebook video and there are certain freeze frames that might indicate a gun on Castile’s lap. I spoke to the attorney of the officer and he said it would not be far fetched to assume that could very well be the gun on his lap because he said his client, the officer, actively responded to the presence of a gun. We have also heard police scanner audio… And that audio appears to indicate that the officer was telling dispatch that the day that the day he pulled that car over that he was pulling the car over because Castile fit the description of a wanted suspect in an armed robbery just a few days prior… The attorney said this would be a valid investigatory stop. The officer went as far as to describe Castile before he got out of the car fitting the description of that wanted suspect… Also, on a side note, the officer Yanez is Mexican according to his attorney.”


Follow the links through before you make up your minds.

edutcher said...

Trooper York said...

Ed is right on the money when he said that this is 1968 redux.

The only thing is there were assassinations in 1968. Kennedy. Martin Luther King.


Does Dallas count as an assassination?

Also GA, MO as attempted?

Asking.

edutcher said...

One other point about Troop's line, "But violence is in the air".

In the late 60s, outfits like SNCC fomented urban riots all across the country. People like Stokeley Carmichael and Rap Brown were in the same racket as Black Narcissus was and still is.

Do.

The.

Math.

Trooper York said...

Oh wait a minute! The cop was a Mexican? Well we all know they are murderers and criminals. Especially Mexican cops. I say we deport him and all the rest of them there like him!

That will solve it. Blacks will not be in any danger then.

Glad we could come up with a solution.

rcocean said...

I refuse to listen to this Nazi-KKK-Trump talk. Some things are just obvious:

1) Every Black man killed by Cop was innocent
2) Every Cop is White - no matter what their skin color
3) All this would go away, if we didn't put Black Crooks in Jail
4) No matter what happens, its White People's Fault
5) Remember to vote Democrat in November, vote early and often!

rcocean said...

We still are nowadays. It's just that not everyone finds breaking treaties and taking land to be as noble as you apparently do. I guess this is the election of indecency. Trump's a douchebag, handing out smallpox-laced blankets is a great thing to do.

What a bunch of Bullshit. If you feel so sorry for the "Poor Indian" give him the deed to your land and go back to Europe. And no American Government official handed out "smallpox-laced blankets" - and if a few did, it probably killed about 10 Indians.

Rabel said...

1. Castile was not the armed robber in the photo. He was not "wanted for armed robbery."

2. Charles C. Johnson is not Charles Johnson. They deserve an equal amount of respect.

3. Another source says Castile did have a "Permit to Carry" from a different jusidiction.

4. My mind is not made up, but I'm definitely leaning towards "Officer panicked and seriously fucked up."

edutcher said...

rcocean said...

If you feel so sorry for the "Poor Indian" give him the deed to your land and go back to Europe. And no American Government official handed out "smallpox-laced blankets" - and if a few did, it probably killed about 10 Indians.

Excellent point. As to the historicity, the only official I ever heard of handing out blankets used for people with smallpox was Lord Jeffrey Amherst (British, of course) during the French and Indian War. As the germ theory of disease was about a century in the future, the odds are he was just getting rid of some ratty old blankets.

As for the deadliness of smallpox to Indians, a couple of tales from history.

When the French captured Fort William Henry during the French and Indian War, one of the reasons it fell was a smallpox epidemic among the garrison. Since the Indian allies did not get a chance to loot the fort in an assault, they attacked the survivors as they were marched out of the fort and murdered a great many. After that, they broke into the fort and, to get more scalps, scalped the dead in the cemetery, many of whom, including Captain Richard Rogers (brother of Robert), had died of the epidemic. These Indians proceeded to go back to their tribes and went into winter quarters. Came the Spring scarcely a man lived to tell the tale.

A century later, on the Montana border with Canada, there was a trading post known as Fort Whoop-Up that traded with the Blackfeet. In addition to rifles and whiskey, they also traded smallpox. The decimation was aggravated by a madness that made warriors murder their families to spare them the ravages of the disease. The Blackfeet even ran to the fort and smeared the edema from their sores on the stockade to give the fort the disease. One reason we never had to fight the Blackfeet for Idaho and Montana was the disease had wiped out so many of them.

edutcher said...

Rabel, we're going to have to see.

I'm on the other side, but you never know.

Rabel said...

You might be right, Ed. You sometimes are. I'll wait to hear from April :)

edutcher said...

Looked at your link.

It relies on the girlfriend and an unnamed source.

We may want something more substantial before this is done.

Rabel said...

Agreed. If he didn't have a permit, St. Anthony PD could shoot down the girlfriend's lie today.

edutcher said...

As I said, last couple of times we went through this, it took a while for all the facts to come out.

That's what I think has to happen now.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Is ed a lawyer?

Rabel said...

That's uncalled for, Ritmo.

rcocean said...

Small pox was a killer disease sometimes, and sometimes not. People forget that White Europeans didn't have an immunity from the disease. For example, in 1721 almost 10% of Boston died from Smallpox. And Boston didn't start vaccinating until 1800.

The difference in death rates between Indians and Whites often occurred because Indians would douse themselves with cold water or snow to "cool off" and ending up dying of pneumonia. Further, the Indians were new to the disease and it them harder, and of course many European adults had already had the disease in childhood, with the dead kids weren't around.

rcocean said...

I'm reading a book on Hawaii and the early Hawaiians were devastated by measles because they couldn't be convinced to stay out of the surf or streams. The fever would drive them mad with heat and no white could convince them that the best thing to do was to stay in bed.

Rhythm and Balls said...

He seems to portray that he's very practiced in the specialized field of immigration law.

Trooper York said...

I think ed is correct we should wait a bit for all the facts to come out. I also think that Rabel is right and that the officer panicked and it was a bogus shooting. The truth most likely lays somewhere in between.

It is possible that Philando had a permit from another jurisdiction. But it is strange that he would have the gun on his lap if that was true. If that is what the photo shows. It is not clear to me.

What is exceedingly strange is the number of tickets and stops this guy had. I don't drive so I don't know but this seems kind of excessive. Even for driving while black. Maybe this guy had a problem behind the wheel. He should definitely had enough experience to handle this without getting shot.

We really need a lot more facts to come out.

edutcher said...

rcocean said...

I'm reading a book on Hawaii and the early Hawaiians were devastated by measles because they couldn't be convinced to stay out of the surf or streams. The fever would drive them mad with heat and no white could convince them that the best thing to do was to stay in bed.

Measles was another big killer among the Indians.

Trooper York said...

I think ed is correct we should wait a bit for all the facts to come out. I also think that Rabel is right and that the officer panicked and it was a bogus shooting. The truth most likely lays somewhere in between.

It is possible that Philando had a permit from another jurisdiction. But it is strange that he would have the gun on his lap if that was true. If that is what the photo shows. It is not clear to me.

What is exceedingly strange is the number of tickets and stops this guy had. I don't drive so I don't know but this seems kind of excessive.


Very. 52 tickets would get your license revoked and maybe a little jail time in most places.

PS Do gun permits expire, like driver's licenses?

Rabel said...

Minnesota requires renewal every five years.

edutcher said...

Well, that's the next issue.

Rhythm and Balls said...

BTW, since I'm not an immigration lawyer (unlike some) I'll note that, while I could be wrong, "political refugee" doesn't just mean you can say "I hate my country. Let me in." It involves demonstrating a need for what's called "asylum."

Asylum means offering sanctuary to someone who is persecuted.

This did not apply to Elian Gonzales.

Further, his father had a legal claim to the child. Legally that counts for something.

We did not kidnap little children even from the USSR.

Finally, with all this talk of Mexico sending, "rapists, drug dealers, murderers," I'm not sure that a Trump supporter like ed has a strong case to make for opening up a Cuban exodus.

You could just as easily say that Mexican migrants are seeking asylum. They are obviously fleeing a not-so-great situation that we blame on their government.

"Political refugees."

bagoh20 said...

Unless Philando was going for his gun, the cop made a mistake that cost a citizen his life simply because the cop misjudged the guy's actions and immediately discharged deadly force. He may have not have even done anything suspicious, but the cop was overly wary and assumed he was someone he was not. Many of the bad shootings are this scenario.

It's pretty scary to me to think that I could be shot dead simply because there are armed men patrolling the streets who so often immediately shoot to kill when they misinterpret a stranger's actions, often due to being misinformed or simply being too fearful. Any one of us could simply misunderstand a cops instructions, not hear correctly, or even not know he's talking to us, and if our actions scare him for any reason, or if he just assumes something incorrect you are dead right now: in your car, in your front yard, in your house in front of your family.

It seems to me that this was not the case in the past. I think cops are being either mis-trained or being hired from the wrong people. They seem to be unnecessarily dangerous - maybe the most dangerous people we encounter on a regular basis right now. I think this is because either by training or culture they are over-sensitised to expect violence, immediately assume they are in a life or death situation with no other option but to kill whatever scares them. It's a very unsafe situation, that I think is new. I want better cops using better methods.

bagoh20 said...

This situation is now likely to get even worse, as cops are clearly now being targeted, which will of course make them more fearful, and lead to more shootings, and more protests and more revenge and on and on. Nice job, lightworker.

ndspinelli said...

Looks like Trump is vetting General Flynn, a registered Dem. His party affiliation doesn't concern me as I have followed him the last few years and he doesn't mince words. He would be exponentially better than that powder puff, pompous, asshole Newt. Actually, edutcher or April would be better than NEWT in my book. LAW AND ORDER has to be the campaign theme. Bernie, Warren and Obama have pushed Hillary far left and the electorate is speeding right.

ndspinelli said...

And, don't think a law and order candidate is going to get no black votes. This scenario is scaring regular black people and some will vote for law and order. They just won't tell their family, friends or pollster. It's still a secret ballot!

edutcher said...

bagoh20 said...

This situation is now likely to get even worse, as cops are clearly now being targeted, which will of course make them more fearful, and lead to more shootings, and more protests and more revenge and on and on. Nice job, lightworker.

All the fringe groups see their chance and they're all going to try to make their mark.

To illustrate, Dallas police HQ is on lockdown.

ndspinelli said...

Looks like Trump is vetting General Flynn, a registered Dem. His party affiliation doesn't concern me as I have followed him the last few years and he doesn't mince words. He would be exponentially better than that powder puff, pompous, asshole Newt. Actually, edutcher or April would be better than NEWT in my book. LAW AND ORDER has to be the campaign theme. Bernie, Warren and Obama have pushed Hillary far left and the electorate is speeding right.

Thanks, I guess.

Both of Lincoln's VPs were Demos, so it's hardly new. And I agree about Newt. He may be an advisor on dealing with Congress, but that will be it.

And, don't think a law and order candidate is going to get no black votes. This scenario is scaring regular black people and some will vote for law and order. They just won't tell their family, friends or pollster. It's still a secret ballot!

Very true. Murder rates among blacks have skyrocketed.

Especially in Demo strongholds like Chiraq.

Sixty Grit said...

Funny how these events have been timed to get Mrs. Clinton out of the news. And by funny, I mean fishy and contrived. Bought and paid for.

edutcher said...

You noticed that, too.

What's interesting is that Cacklepants is still trying to tell people everything was legal and aboveboard.

Somehow, I have the feeling this is polling like Willie's handling of L'Affaire Monica.

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

So what?

It appears he was pulled over because he looked like a robbery suspect (it was not a broken tail light). It might explain why the cop was jumpy, but that does not (in itself)excuse shooting the guy. I do know not know if Castile was acting in a manner that justified the cop putting five shots into him. We wait and see on that.

But the timing of all of this for Hillary is awe-fully suspicious (as Sixty notes).

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

It links say it was initially traffic, then the cop thought Philandro looked like a robbery suspect they were looking for.

But so far I have seen no suggestion Philandro was really the robbery suspect.

This whole shooting turns on what Philandro did just before the shooting. Is there any video of that? We don't know yet.

edutcher said...

That's why I keep saying, stay cool and wait.

Remember, the Gentle Giant also looked like a cop gone off the track at first.

Thing is, he fit the description to a T and this occurred just a few blocks from the scene of the crime.

And don't call him by his first name like he's your pal. Sounds like you've already made up your mind the cop did wrong.

AllenS said...

Something about this Philandro incident that has been really bothering me, is his so-called girlfriend. What type of person, girlfriend or not, video tapes the man slowly losing his life, and keeps on video taping him passing?

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

AllenS, I thought that odd too, but the cop told her not to move so all she could do is operate the cell phone with her hands visible. They were worried about the gun so until she was out of the car they just kept her in place. If you thought he was wrongfully shot, video taping does make sense if that is all you can do. It also could be if he was up to no good, trying to change the story. We don't know yet.

And ed, I could call him Philandro or Castile, so what? Stop reading into things. It's annoying.

Sixty Grit said...

She is just as sick as he was, but now, not as dead, except in her soul.

His name is Philando - no "r". An "r" in there would indicate that he was a man. He was not. His name tells his whole story - Section 8. One need know no more than that. Buh bye. Now once your family gets paid by the tax payers, you will be rich, for a brief shining moment.

And, I say again, he has sacrificed his life of crime to save another crime family, the Clintons.

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

I am sure Minnesota will throw money at his family (and at his girlfriend). Doesn't do "Phil" any good. You take the bullets and the girlfriend and family get the money.

Getting pulled over 50+ times is a bit much, but if I added it up, I have probably been pulled over at least 20 times, maybe more. Can't say I enjoyed it (but I like to drive fast at times). That along does not account for much of a "life of crime."

While it certainly changed the topic from the Comey presser, this event did not save Clinton. No one in the media was focusing too hard on Hillary's faults once Comey gave her the pass. The #FixIsIn already in on that too. For what ever reason Trump has not attempted to go after her too hard on it, with this going on now he is probably better off waiting a bit before doing so. I assume he plans to do so.

The WaPo is trying to stir the pot with the NRA. Trying to imply it was racist or something in not responding fast enough to Philando Castile's case. I guess waiting a day and a half to make sure you have the facts right is crazy or something. The last thing the liberal media and Democrats want is the NRA championing a black man with a CCP.

AprilApple said...

Evi - " For what ever reason Trump has not attempted to go after her too hard on it, with this going on now he is probably better off waiting a bit before doing so. I assume he plans to do so. "

Don't hold your breathe. Hillary's good friend Trump will not be hitting her hard. Now or ever. He does not have the intellectual or articulation skills needed to do so, and he doesn't have the will.

Sixty Grit said...

The cow is a scofflaw - news flash, eh?

As for Phil-and-O - those are just the things he got caught for. Anyone dim enough to get pulled over and forced to interact with police that many times is too stupid to live.

Trump will do nothing. That is not his nature. He will give a speech, seen by hundreds, send a tweet then disappear. He is as useless as teats on a boar.

edutcher said...

AllenS said...

Something about this Philandro incident that has been really bothering me, is his so-called girlfriend. What type of person, girlfriend or not, video tapes the man slowly losing his life, and keeps on video taping him passing?

You broke the code. She's looking for a payday.

Maybe a job with Loretta Lynch.

edutcher said...

AprilApple said...

Evi - " For what ever reason Trump has not attempted to go after her too hard on it, with this going on now he is probably better off waiting a bit before doing so. I assume he plans to do so. "

Don't hold your breathe. Hillary's good friend Trump will not be hitting her hard. Now or ever. He does not have the intellectual or articulation skills needed to do so, and he doesn't have the will.


All part of the Crooked Hillary meme, but April doesn't want to see that.

Just like the One True Ted and his delegate poaching - let them hang themselves.

The last week or so didn't save Hillary, it just made her look that much more guilty. NeverTrumpers seem to be too dense to get that.

edutcher said...

Sixty Grit said...

The cow is a scofflaw - news flash, eh?

As for Phil-and-O - those are just the things he got caught for. Anyone dim enough to get pulled over and forced to interact with police that many times is too stupid to live.

Trump will do nothing. That is not his nature. He will give a speech, seen by hundreds, send a tweet then disappear. He is as useless as teats on a boar.


Lavish is nothing. You really don't get it. Fulminating over gets him nada.

Let the animals run wild. Is Hillary going to rein them in? People want to be safe.

Hillary won't do that. As someone elsewhere noted, the crazies are the Demos' SA.

People are seeing that.

AprilApple said...

@ Sixty
"Trump will do nothing. That is not his nature. He will give a speech, seen by hundreds, send a tweet then disappear. He is as useless as teats on a boar."

His blind faith koolaid drinkers will invent a fantasy that he WILL do something. Trump's just waiting while he drops in the polls and lets Hillary clean the floor with him. But you watch! He's just keeping his powder dry. or something.

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

If Philando Castile was some guy legally with a gun who got shot because the cop panicked (thinking he was an armed robber) that is a story worth finding out. If it turns out he really was the robbery suspect, that matters (a lot) too.

And from a NRA perspective, this is a wedge issue (if the former is true) to use against leftists and Democrats. But apparently Sixty and ed don't get that.

Scoff law? I guess, but hey, I like to drive fast. Meh.

I am sure April, baring him dropping out voluntarily, Trump will be the nominee. Sixty and you think Trump is useless-- We will see what happens. I am sure ed and Troop are writing Trump lots of checks to help pay for the ad buys.

edutcher said...

AprilApple said...

@ Sixty
"Trump will do nothing. That is not his nature. He will give a speech, seen by hundreds, send a tweet then disappear. He is as useless as teats on a boar."

His blind faith koolaid drinkers will invent a fantasy that he WILL do something. Trump's just waiting while he drops in the polls and lets Hillary clean the floor with him. But you watch! He's just keeping his powder dry. or something.


I don't hear any of April's wet dreams among the Whigs speaking out on any of this. This would be a swell time for the One True Ted to show what a law and order guy he is, so he can steal the nomination. Anybody hear anything but crickets?

If you knew anything about politics - and, trust me, you know less than nothing - you'd know lawlessness and rioting is the big issue. It affects everybody. Of the people out there paying attention - and that's damned few right now - a lot less are worried about Hillary than the fact they may not be safe because of all the rioting.

How many tourist dollars are being lost because people are afraid to go near any big city? Last night it was Baton Rouge, St Paul, and San Antonio. In a couple of weeks, Cleveland and then Philadelphia.

Pull your head out of your ass and get a clue.

Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

If Philando Castile was some guy legally with a gun who got shot because the cop panicked (thinking he was an armed robber) that is a story worth finding out. If it turns out he really was the robbery suspect, that matters (a lot) too.

And from a NRA perspective, this is a wedge issue (if the former is true) to use against leftists and Democrats. But apparently Sixty and ed don't get that.


Castile is nothing. One more summer felon who becomes an excuse to burn down a city.

The issue is the race hate fomented by the Choom Gang and the lawlessness it creates, but you and the NeverTrumpers don't get that.

And, last I looked, the NRA is not running for President.

Sixty Grit said...

Blogger Evi L. Bloggerlady said...

"Scoff law? I guess, but hey, I like to drive fast. Meh."

Laws are for little cows - spoken like a true supporter of Mrs. Clinton.

"I am sure April, baring him dropping out voluntarily..."

Work on your spelling, cow, did you really mean "baring him"? If so, you are one sick trans-speciest tranny.

AprilApple said...

Castile is nothing? Wow you're a f*cking racist shit, ed.

edutcher said...

In the overall scheme of things, he's not a blip on the political radar.

It's the excuse to make a riot that's the issue.

We're right back in the late 60s. As someone observed.

ndspinelli said...

People are ignorant of history. I've been waiting to hear someone, anywhere, compare the current culture of violence, hatred, lawlessness, etc. to the 1960's. And then to point out who ran on "law and order" and won the Presidency. This all plays into Trump's tiny hands. As long as he doesn't piss on both legs this issue will put him in the WH. I think he can continue to piss on one leg and still win. Just not both legs. Maybe someone needs to hold his dick to help him aim. I think we would have a couple volunteers right here, and many more throughout the country.

July 8, 2016 at 6:04 PM

rcocean said...

We have almost a million cops in this country making millions of arrests every year. The idea the they all have to "retrained" because one of them may - or may not - have used excessive force is dumb.

rcocean said...

The reflective anti-cop attitude seems to have become a class marker. The more wealthy and insulated you are, the more likely you are express contempt and dislike for the police and support for the average crook.

I'm sure Zuckerpick hates the cops, after he doesn't need them. He's got a wall around his palatial mansions and an army of security guards.

rcocean said...

Tom Wolfe wrote about this 46 years ago when Lenny Bernstein was fundraising for the Black Panthers in his million dollar luxury apartment.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Remember April, ed thinks human life has no intrinsic value. He prefers street killings (by cop or crook) to courts of justice.

So the only value any people (let alone their rights) have, to him, is how they can be made into part of a political movement.

Welcome to Trump-ism. Nixonian pretensions to law and order, but without the facade of constitutional consideration. Just one big race-on-race war - blind justice and racial colorblindness be damned. It's all about what group you're from.

edutcher said...

Ritmo makes an ass of himself once again from inside his gated community and proves the wisdom of rc's comment about class markers.

April wants Trump to denounce Castile 24/7 (why isn't Ritmo denouncing April?) as a way of attacking Hillary and I say Castile is not the issue, so Ritmo does a classic Alinsky and tries to turn my answer into something else. But he is foolish enough to link Trump to Nixon, who denounced the '68 rioting and won the White House doing it. That's what he really doesn't like.

But then, he probably also approves of the riots in Dallas, St Paul, Baton Rouge, San Antonio, and, now we learn, Chiraq.

AprilApple said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
AprilApple said...

Balls- You got it.
Ed is such a Trump koolaid drinking moron - nobody and nothing matters except his false god. Nothing matters, except all narratives that lead to votes for the false god.

I'm not sure yet is Philando was a criminal, or what really happened before the tape started rolling - but the tape doesn't look good. And the guy IS dead. And he, even as a criminal - his life has value. After all the false narratives and lies about Ferguson, this issue is such a mess. [what Bagoh said above is the paradigm in all of our major cities]

ooo add yet another idiotic and tired strawman lecture non-argument from Ed. Bottom line - Ed and his constant annoying lecturing makes Trump look even worse. If this is what Trump supporters think - no thanks.

edutcher said...

Well, it should surprise no one April is the only one here who agrees with Ritmo.

And, if she looked, she'd find I'm only quoting history, the history I've been quoting since February, but that doesn't matter because all April can do is hate and deny anything that doesn't fit her prejudices.

And, from what she says about Castile, I guess her false god really is Hillary because, once Hillary stops saying, "I did nothing improper", she's going to resurrect this guy as the son she wishes she hadn't aborted.

And some day she may even look up what a straw man is.

edutcher said...

And what to my wondering eyes should appear, but Hillary telling white people we should sympathize of all the felons who run afoul of the duly constituted law enforcement officers.

edutcher said...

AllenS said...

Something about this Philandro incident that has been really bothering me, is his so-called girlfriend. What type of person, girlfriend or not, video tapes the man slowly losing his life, and keeps on video taping him passing?

So they'd have a payday, how much the grieving family has collected already.

Note Mom's rap sheet.

bagoh20 said...

Wow, the deceased's mother sure is a winner. It's disgusting that someone with that rap sheet is raking in hundreds of thousands of dollars in sympathy money now. Infuriating, and how appropriate it is to elect Hillary for her. They have identical values and sources of income.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Oh, boo hoo. Eddie doesn't like rioting.

Well, then let's go denounce it. I know that will make a real difference!

Or even better: Completely militarize the police force! After all, deep down, Americans are really all just a bunch of worthless hajjis with no rights, who deserve to be occupied and patrolled under armed surveillance 24/7.

No wonder he thinks people objecting to this (most everyone) live in "gated communities." That's basically where he'd force all the decent, civilized people to flee to.

Nixon never divided people by race or origin. He at least had the good sense to keep his bigotry confined to WH tape recordings that he figured wouldn't go public as long as his lawbreaking hadn't been discovered.

Trump just rallies the radical racists more openly.

Most Hispanics are more integrated and Americanized than ed is.

Rhythm and Balls said...

It's disgusting that someone with that rap sheet is raking in hundreds of thousands of dollars in sympathy money now.

Three cheers for capitalism and free speech! I believe the proper term for these people is "entrepreneurs."

The very sort of people that Bags of 90210 thinks America needs to cater to over and above everyone else.

They are just playing by your own rules, BagsO! Give them a break, and welcome them into the fold.

You've taught them well.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Anyway, in the interest of balance, fairness and honesty, I do believe that Bags is bang on the money with his previous, 7:33 PM comment.

He's a mixed bag (no pun intended). Sometimes he gets it dead-on, but his blindness to the politics that have made the creation of a Trump inevitable - i find that absolutely dismaying.

Trump is a symptom not the disease.

edutcher said...

Rhythm and Balls said...

Oh, boo hoo. Eddie doesn't like rioting.

You just made rc's point for him.

In case it never made your copy of Town&Country, most areas hit with this kind of rioting never come back. But Ritmo doesn't have to look at it in his gated community, so what care he?

Rhythm and Balls said...

You just made rc's point for him.

I made no point other than your reliance on/addiction to ineffective measures.

I live in a more economically diverse and open community than you will ever see in your life. I live in the middle of one of the least closed communities in America if not the world, and see and interact and rub shoulders with people of all sorts every day. There are beggars, in fact - kind of like you, ed. Just with less pride.

The last thing I have to do is answer to a sheltered asshole like you on community economic isolation. Tell me your zip code and let's compare, you utter piece of shit.

AprilApple said...

Parasites are not entrepreneurs, Balls. You should learn the difference.

Rhythm and Balls said...

I'm just giving bags a hard time. I like him but he disappoints me for hating Trump while wanting to continue the exact same policies that make Trumps inevitable.

edutcher said...

Ooooh, I assaulted Ritmo's privileged lifestyle.

He's reacted to my microaggression with a tantrum and now must go to his safe space.

PS Yeah, we have beggars here, too. They have a cardboard sign and are dropped by the overpass by a nice car and do a shift of about 4 hours before they're picked up to split the take.

Here, however, they're called bums.

Rhythm and Balls said...

In case it never made your copy of Town&Country

Let it be known that ed judges people on what they choose to buy. Not on where they choose to live and what they choose to make of their community, how they contribute to it, the hardships it undergoes, the problems it faces.

So he kind of sounds like a communist, really. A self-isolating communist. He finds the character of a man in his purchasing patterns, not the people he surrounds himself with as a part of his community.

Seriously, what a dolt. What an idiotic, doltish asshole.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Ooooh, I assaulted Ritmo's privileged lifestyle.

Let the record show that a "lifestyle" is an individual thing and doesn't say anything about one's community - at least not in the economic terms that communist ed is so interested in.

Did you figure out what zip code you live in yet, ed? I want you to show me all that economic diversity and "salt-of-the-earthniess" you're suddenly all about in the Age of Candidate Trump.

Rhythm and Balls said...

Here, however, they're called bums.

And what are you called?

I seriously want to know.

A non-homeowner?

A non-jobholder?

What description do you go by?

Why are you so nasty to people that you don't really have all that much not in common with?

The answer to that is obvious. Keeping up with the Joneses is a harder-played game the closer you are, economically, to the Joneses.

People making $45k think they're much better than those making $35k.

Trump's skin gets ruffled by REAL billionaires. He's so close to being considered one of them that he can taste, touch, feel and smell it. And it drives him crazy.

ed hates the poor as much as he hates the rich. Just for different reasons. One class he has to be better than and the other class he wants to say "How dare you!" to since he presumes they're better than him.

Most people are better than ed but it has nothing to do with wealth or poverty. He'll never know what it is.

Trooper York said...

Trump is wise to restate his support of the police and law and order. He doesn't need to overplay his hand.

Similarly he doesn't need to hammer Hillary right now with the email stuff. It would get drowned out in the wake of Dallas and the wholesale murder of policemen by Obama's supporters.

Events will favor him. There will be more riots by the criminals and their families who make up Black Lives Matter. There will be more terrorist attacks by people let into this country or by home grown knuckleheads influenced by the radical clerics imported by Obama and Hillary and Paul Ryan and all the rest who denounce Trump. There will be attacks at both conventions. There will be revelations of Hillary's emails by foreign powers who hacked them with who knows what damaging information.

Trump can sit back a little and cruise into the convention. If he can make a good VP choice he will build momentum. He could have the wisdom of Aristotle, the eloquence of Lincoln and the probity of Washington and none of it would make a difference to April or others who insist on losing like the Washington Generals. Trump is doing it different. He needs to keep being Trump win or lose. It got him here and it will get him over the top. Events favor him. He just doesn't need to get in the way as more people pay attention.